SSJ Vs Kaioken

Quote from Neofito

You could use full CD accesories, then use SSJ, Kid Buu or GN and your transformation cooldown will be less. I remember taking it down to 45 min in old DBO.

Having full cooldown equipment + Martial Artist cooldown buff in DBO KR meant I could go SSJ every 14 minutes. Cooldown got nerfed since. ;~;

What's more important is how useful the transformation is when you're actually using it. It doesn't matter how much ENG you have, you don't regenerate enough EP in combat to keep up fights for long, so you'll end up wasting time sitting around recovering you could've otherwise used to keep fighting. The stat boosts are minimal, and since you can't use better buffs like Kaioken or Thunder in SSJ form either, it's mostly just for toying around.

SSJ
i have no problem with the ep drain. remember in pvp everybody will use auto pots and you have another ep pot and you have only 3 minutes for a fight so you wont lose the energy in that time. in party pve u can get ep reg buffs and dont need to drink. just in solo pve its a little problem

If you take healer buffs into account, then of course SSJ keepup becomes a non-issue, but the same could be said about Kaioken, which grants more damage. As all human races are focused on damage, this puts SSJ second to Kaioken. The issue isn't about being able to keep SSJ up or not, it's that the transformation's stat boosts aren't worth the hassle of trying to keep it up in the first place.

Also, you really should never consider SSJ for PvP. The transformation animation takes FOREVER, it's weaker than Kaioken, and it has a massive cooldown. You'd be a fool to use it anywhere other than the PvP platform in Korin. Trust me, I tried going Super Saiyan during a Budokai once, that battle did NOT end well for me.

Quote from EchoSon

Yeah, that's how it was in TW too. Sadly, SSJ is pretty insignificant despite it's massive cooldown, EP drain and of course the hype of being a freaking Super Saiyan. Dodge-based fighters might prefer it over Kaioken right now, but if the critical hit boost from stacking Kaiokens return, then it will outclass those benefits too.

Wait? Kaioken doesn't stack critical hit rate anymore? What's the purpose of leveling the skill & using more than Kaioken x1 then?

BECAUSE TRANSFORMATIONS ARE SHIT!

FIX IT @Daneos.
Please. ♥

Quote from Neisan

BECAUSE TRANSFORMATIONS ARE SHIT!

FIX IT @Daneos.
Please. ♥

true i had high hopes about super saiyan transformations but it was really a disappointment

your frame rate of your pc must be that of a nokia 3410.

Other then that, i agree, ssj is just a garbage wish atm (even money is better).

Quote from nikolassj

Wait? Kaioken doesn't stack critical hit rate anymore? What's the purpose of leveling the skill & using more than Kaioken x1 then?

Daneous will add critical rate on kaikoen until he fixes the stats for everything.

Quote from gojonoku

Other then that, i agree, ssj is just a garbage wish atm (even money is better).

I mean, that's a BIT of an exaggeration. It's still a neat secondary transformation when you're in a UD and both Kaioken and Thunder are cooling down or something like that.

Quote from nikolassj

Wait? Kaioken doesn't stack critical hit rate anymore? What's the purpose of leveling the skill & using more than Kaioken x1 then?

Leveling the skill increases the Kaioken base damage. For now there's no reason to stack Kaiokens, however, as for whatever reason no effects aren't implemented yet.

Quote from Neisan

FIX IT @Daneos.
Please. ♥

"Fix it Daneos" to the rescue. ...I think it's putting it a bit too simply.

Huh, I thought that leveling it makes you sustain it better

Quote from nikolassj

Huh, I thought that leveling it makes you sustain it better

it does its just bugged niko

ssj always. With any piece with 26 energy or 20 Ep regeneración that worth perfect. Also ussing cooldown buffs the cooldown time is only 20 or 25 minuts.
Kaioken consume LP and EP a lot...
The ssj only costa a few EP. There is not any posible discussion.

ssj always. With any piece with 26 energy or 20 Ep regeneración that worth perfect. Also ussing cooldown buffs the cooldown time is only 20 or 25 minuts.
Kaioken consume LP and EP a lot...
The ssj only costa a few EP. There is not any posible discussion. also check Your power level and stats and Your Ep when you are ssj. Your EP up the 90% more than before.. Making a totally to 190% Ep in Your character... For the physical clases that thing not make any sense... But if you are crane or turtle... You will feel Your clases a lot more strong.

Quote from edu1980

ssj always. With any piece with 26 energy or 20 Ep regeneración that worth perfect. Also ussing cooldown buffs the cooldown time is only 20 or 25 minuts.
Kaioken consume LP and EP a lot...
The ssj only costa a few EP. There is not any posible discussion.

I'm afraid you're picking "comfortable to keepup" over actual power and usefullness. Kaioken has very little advantage on keeping it up, since SSJ cools down while you're using it, while Kaioken doesn't. But it's actual cooldown is tiny. Remember, if you're getting SSJ's CD down to 20 minutes, that means Kaioken goes down to 2 minutes as well. We're not even CONSIDERING the possibility of picking ENG 26 armor, which could've been CON/DEX, actually useful for survival stats.(And CON helps to keep up Kaioken too)

If you need to defeat a powerfull enemy, Kaioken wins due to it's higher attack power and stacking versatility. If you're doing a TMQ/UD, a stacked Kaioken absolutely destroys SSJ's buff and is incredibly easy to keep up thanks to healers. If you're in West City and want to dash around all fast? ...Kaioken, of course. Why waste a skill with half an hour of cooldown?

Even if you just want to take out a group of mobs quick for grinding reasons, Kaioken is great due to it's small CD and non-commitment. You can turn it off the second you're done or uncomfortable on LP/EP, and know you'll get it back in no time. With SSJ, it feels like a waste to turn it off after 1 minute.

Quote from edu1980

also check Your power level and stats and Your Ep when you are ssj. Your EP up the 90% more than before.. Making a totally to 190% Ep in Your character... For the physical clases that thing not make any sense... But if you are crane or turtle... You will feel Your clases a lot more strong.

Power level is irrelevant. If it mattered, then a Great Namekian would be the most powerful foe in all of DBO. EP is also irrelevant to actual power. That just affects how often you can use skills, and you should have enough EP as any race to take out anything before you ever need to worry, especially with a healer. Kaioken's LP drain isn't a big deal because it drains so little compared to the extra damage you would otherwise take from enemies, and if you have a healer, it doesn't matter at all.

SSJ is neat to have, especially as a secondary transformation that looks awesome. But just because it's more comfortable to keep up than Kaioken, doesn't making sitting around any more productive. The ultimate way to grind mobs is in your base form. For everything else there's Kaioken.

lol not need type so long texts... Since is easy to explaint... Kaioken suck if you not have a healer near to you lol... Also in ssj you pick more damage pero hit or pero skill + the Lp not go down... Ssj only consumes EP. Also recibing the double of your natural EP is more easy eat potions slow (aproatching the potions cooldown) or put any energy piece or any ep regeneration piece. repeating... is not posible compared the kaioken with the ssj.

A lot of people forget that Humans while transformed can use all of their skills unlike Namekians & Majins which is kinda unfair.
Great Namek is only good for tanking, Kid Buu for AoE damage.... SSJ boosts all of their stats a bit, except defense + allows humans to use all of their abilities.

Quote from nikolassj

A lot of people forget that Humans while transformed can use all of their skills unlike Namekians & Majins which is kinda unfair.
Great Namek is only good for tanking, Kid Buu for AoE damage.... SSJ boosts all of their stats a bit, except defense + allows humans to use all of their abilities.

That may be true, but SSJ is nonetheless crap

Yeah, still its like a "super buff", like a "dragon buff" for example just without duration... It might need a little bit of buffing and nothing more.

Quote from nikolassj

Yeah, still its like a "super buff", like a "dragon buff" for example just without duration... It might need a little bit of buffing and nothing more.

Nah, I don't agree with that. Dragonbuffs can be stacked with anything, giving nothing but advantages.(Though they're too slow to be worth it in Budokai/Ranked, just like SSJ) With SSJ, you lose the ability to use Kaioken and Thunder&Storm, which are both superior buffs, and therefore make it not an "upgrade" over your usual arsenal at all.