Let's talk Fighter Masterclass Skills!

  • There was a thing I found as a bug, early days of PRE-open-beta, that Needles were able to knock down quite often without using RP, of course they can't do that and they were not suposed to, but the bug was quite interesting. It would be really usefull to knock down with needles, as the only way for a fighter to KD someone, is by spending points at energy attacks. Swordsmen have KD with the skill "Multiple Sword Slashes" wich is extremely useful and is physical damage. This might be quite overpowered, but with some damage reduction it could be really helpful for fighters to have more strategy.

  • There was a thing I found as a bug, early days of PRE-open-beta, that Needles were able to knock down quite often without using RP, of course they can't do that and they were not suposed to, but the bug was quite interesting. It would be really usefull to knock down with needles, as the only way for a fighter to KD someone, is by spending points at energy attacks. Swordsmen have KD with the skill "Multiple Sword Slashes" wich is extremely useful and is physical damage. This might be quite overpowered, but with some damage reduction it could be really helpful for fighters to have more strategy.

    SM shouldn't even have that tbh, they only got it in the very late stages of 55 cap or 60 cap i can't remember the patch, but regardless it always seemed dumb to me that the class with the highest DPS potential now had some of the best single target crowd control in the game, Its tolerable though because reflect kills and with all the bugs with rp and kd it seems that SM is even harder to play. But still, from a human perspective its not really fair that you wont get a chance to play dbo if he lands a stun/kd on you now is it? I suppose there is always super saiyan but still.


    21 is one of best fighters in DBOG(if not the best next to billy [and the bossman himself, jocer.] kappa) and he makes excellent use of the energy skills in his strategies. Since you cannot crit when you KD, i don't think it would be too broken, since fighters have trash base damage anyway, but then there is also the issue of can Daneos actually do it? and would he do it even if he could?

  • You're pulling that 80% from your nose. Fighters were horrible back when they had bleed and no speed. Even speed isn't that useful on a Fighter now. Try comparing crit strategies and speed strategies on a boss and you'll see what I mean. The speed cap is too low for Fighters for them to deal the damage they did in retail. Spamming needles(use cooldown RP preferably) with crit gear deals more damage. The main reason to use Thunder now is for it's overpowered stunlock.(Until someone brings anti-confuse or reflect gear, in which case that goes out of the window too)

    Anyway, you miss the point. This isn't about buffing or nerfing Fighters. It's about fun. If we brought back bleed, it'd STILL be all about the needles and RNG dodges, and that's just no fun for either party. Instead of having 3 super-overpowered skills, let's just nerf them a bit and make their other skills more competent so we can have a whole array of options like other classes do.

    Fighter was only weaksauce in 60 cap because of how broken anti crit chips were combined with no real prop accessory cap or reflect cap, and SK steal life being the most OP thing ever since mobile phones, yeah NTL failed big time in balancing.


    If they just removed crit chips or even better just cap anti-crit like it should've been capped anyway and the needle bleed durations were buffed, then fighter would've been in a good place, instead they gave them a broken 1 shot button which is just stupid as it made an underdog class that took a lot of effort to make work when everyone had 100% anticrit, a really lame press 3 buttons win dbo after chips were removed. Also a simple dash behind after you stun them isn't much to ask for anyway, which still makes 1 shots an issue.


    I see no real reason why bleeds cannot come back besides noobs not wanting their 1 shot mechanic taken away because they want this game to not take any skill or they just want an easy mode class, or daneos being stubborn as usual when it comes to listening to the community. The other changes are good though.

  • SM shouldn't even have that tbh, they only got it in the very late stages of 55 cap or 60 cap i can't remember the patch, but regardless it always seemed dumb to me that the class with the highest DPS potential now had some of the best single target crowd control in the game, Its tolerable though because reflect kills and with all the bugs with rp and kd it seems that SM is even harder to play. But still, from a human perspective its not really fair that you wont get a chance to play dbo if he lands a stun/kd on you now is it? I suppose there is always super saiyan but still.


    21 is one of best fighters in DBOG(if not the best next to billy [and the bossman himself, jocer.] kappa) and he makes excellent use of the energy skills in his strategies. Since you cannot crit when you KD, i don't think it would be too broken, since fighters have trash base damage anyway, but then there is also the issue of can Daneos actually do it? and would he do it even if he could?

    So having one KD makes the fighter broken, but other classes having multiple KD, don't make them broken? If the Fighter's damage is trash, then I don't see the point of complaining. Turtles have more damage when they crit compared to a SM AND they have KD in the same skill which is also in area (I've seen many one shots of full party budokai made by a single turtle), so I don't see why the fighter can't have a KD that helps him with his main damage that is the physical one just like the SM, and the SM is not broken.

  • So having one KD makes the fighter broken, but other classes having multiple KD, don't make them broken? If the Fighter's damage is trash, then I don't see the point of complaining. Turtles have more damage when they crit compared to a SM AND they have KD in the same skill which is also in area (I've seen many one shots of full party budokai made by a single turtle), so I don't see why the fighter can't have a KD that helps him with his main damage that is the physical one just like the SM, and the SM is not broken.

    I can actually agree with Santo. He and I PvP'd before in PoB while I used my Swordsman against his Fighter.

  • So having one KD makes the fighter broken, but other classes having multiple KD, don't make them broken? If the Fighter's damage is trash, then I don't see the point of complaining. Turtles have more damage when they crit compared to a SM AND they have KD in the same skill which is also in area (I've seen many one shots of full party budokai made by a single turtle), so I don't see why the fighter can't have a KD that helps him with his main damage that is the physical one just like the SM, and the SM is not broken.

    Nah i don't think it would be broken, its just i'm doubtful it can be done nor would it really help fighter out that much because of his low base damage and its % damage as well. I agree on turtles being able to fully wipe a team in 5v5,or like 12 players in dojo war. It's definitely unfair and they don't need 1 shots and a book that gives them a crapload of defense and nearly instant full rp. Fighter will become good if things like props on accessories, reflect, get capped and i honestly believe that %lp should be capped even further. Echo's changes will also help a bit to make mirror matchups less reliant on who prayed harder to rngesus or who has better ping.

  • I see no real reason why bleeds cannot come back besides noobs not wanting their 1 shot mechanic taken away because they want this game to not take any skill or they just want an easy mode class, or daneos being stubborn as usual when it comes to listening to the community. The other changes are good though.

    It's moreso that bleeds don't suit the Fighter's playstyle. They're a terrible focus class, DEX stacks wonderfully with their crit boosts, and bleed are easily countered while raw damage isn't....which is a HUGE issue when you consider Fighters have nothing but needles going for them atm. We can cap anti-crit, but that just increases our RNG's success....it doesn't make the class any more fun to play. Besides, Swordsmen and Turtles can both surpass our raw damage when they use Glaring Slash/Weaken Defense, yet they have all these other options available to stall, stunlock, hit you from multiple places on the battlefield, etc. I don't see how bleeds fix anything other than giving opposing classes more time to counter our already extremely limited strategies.

    That said, I'd be down for only one of the needles getting bleed for variety's sake. It's incredibly lame they're both the same attack, and the only constant PvP options available. Though I doubt adding a bleed to one of the needles would enrich our simple-to-a-fault playstyle much.

    There was a thing I found as a bug, early days of PRE-open-beta, that Needles were able to knock down quite often without using RP, of course they can't do that and they were not suposed to, but the bug was quite interesting. It would be really usefull to knock down with needles, as the only way for a fighter to KD someone, is by spending points at energy attacks. Swordsmen have KD with the skill "Multiple Sword Slashes" wich is extremely useful and is physical damage. This might be quite overpowered, but with some damage reduction it could be really helpful for fighters to have more strategy.

    That would make them TOO similar to Swordsmen imo. Swordsmen are all about accuracy, but Fighters are more about dodging their enemies, so why not have Fighters focus more on countering? A Kamikaze Ghost can knock down your enemy even when you're stunned, assuming you called it out beforehand. With my alt suggestion of Solar Flare, if timed right in the middle of an SK's bold strike animation for example, it would almost guarantee you'd evade at least that. Same with the Swiftness suggestion, both that move and Solar Flare would encourage the enemy to back off and make both PvPers dash all over the place for the upper hand. That'd be hype.

    But naturally moves like this work both ways. The Shadow Knight could feint the Fighter, pretending to charge Violent Slice, then suddenly cancel it and then buff/charge RP/throw out Bold Strike instead, making the Fighter waste their precious invincibility. Or the Fighter could dash up to the Shadow Knight pretending to go on the offense, but then throw out Swiftness to dodge his Paralysis. Or maybe the SK expects that feint from you...which means you could just run up to him all casually and Kidney Shot him without even wasting your Quick Attack.

    There'd be mindgames, strategy, timing, and choices of when to use your moves. It's not like because your needle's cooled down, you must throw it out ASAP when in range. If your enemy's on the run, should you use a needle the instant you're in range, or try to get a stun/KD in first so you can hit them from behind for possibly huge damage? With an RP-ball Blitz Fist and a Kamikaze Ghost that knocks people down, you have those opportunities now, but they also give your enemy a free chance to attack while you're raising a ghost or buffing.

    This is the vision I'm having here. I'm looking for intense matches for both players involved, not your usual nerfs and buffs. But because these changes are based on the skill and predictions of BOTH players, it becomes less about which class is OP, and more about which player is OP. If you get your ass predicted in fights like this, you can say it's your own fault when you lose. Well....in theory anyway! ;)

  • That said, I'd be down for only one of the needles getting bleed for variety's sake. It's incredibly lame they're both the same attack, and the only constant PvP options available. Though I doubt adding a bleed to one of the needles would enrich our simple-to-a-fault playstyle much.

    I think that would be the best for all players, HSN gets bleed, SHSN gets crit bonus but from behind but the base % dmg is reduced a bit.

  • Alright I read all what my mate EchoSon posted and most of posts here too.

    I like most of suggestions that EchoSon made and as some of you too, as my boy SHEEN .


    I agree with fact that " HSN gets bleed, SHSN gets crit bonus but from behind but the base % dmg is reduced a bit ", this.


    About Kamikaze, they really sux, they should auto attack and should be buffed with fighter speed buffs to help in PVE and with command to blow up, but I don't see its use in PVP, you mostly won't have time for it.


    Blitz Fist - gives RP nah, it should give move speed and dodge, there is MA RP buff for that.

    Solar Flare - I understand and I agree with Echo.


    I see there is no IT here, it should be 2 sec long range stun, in PVP range 35m - 45m.


    Swiftness - yea I agree with this, it should help those fighters.



    I agree with most of things here and in general everything that would make fighter class more skill based and class that you look forward to face in PVP, because you know you would have some "mind game" and fun time.

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  • Blitz Fist - gives RP nah, it should give move speed and dodge, there is MA RP buff for that.

    Completely agree with this, a 25% (for example) of speed instead of 20% would be more than enough, Pokos give 25% and are the only ones that can make a fighter (and the rest of humans) reach their max of speed. A figher should have this by himself. The dodge part, doesn't seem that necessary to be honest, and as much as I would love the buff, is not necessary.

  • Completely agree with this, a 25% (for example) of speed instead of 20% would be more than enough, Pokos give 25% and are the only ones that can make a fighter (and the rest of humans) reach their max of speed. A figher should have this by himself. The dodge part, doesn't seem that necessary to be honest, and as much as I would love the buff, is not necessary.

    It is necessary, since think about it.

    If fighter use Thunder and their Storm skill have no affect on tankers due anti confuse accessory, this dodge increase buff would give them chance to guard against SK bold strike skill.


    In critic mode or builds there is swiftness, while in speed mode there is blitz fist.

    Ofc swiftness and blitz shouldn't stack, since both of them gives dodge rate, just in case we don't make fighters even more OP than they are now.


    What we will have now is class with more defense skills than SM who is pure offensive DPS.

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  • About Kamikaze, they really sux, they should auto attack and should be buffed with fighter speed buffs to help in PVE and with command to blow up, but I don't see its use in PVP, you mostly won't have time for it.


    Blitz Fist - gives RP nah, it should give move speed and dodge, there is MA RP buff for that.

    Dodge won't help you against success rate attacks/stuns, though. We'd run into the same issue that we have with Solar Flare now. And you can remove Thunder and use Solar Flare/Swiftness if you miss Storm and don't wanna risk leaving your life to RNG. I've also used that to kill (reflect) tanks with a needle when I would've died otherwise.

    Also, I know there's an MA RP buff, but they both serve a different purpose. Blitz Fist would give an RP ball faster on the short term. With the MA buff you'd need to buff AND charge after that. Sure, in the long-term charging will be faster, but while long-term is great for Swordsmen, Fighters don't have an as-efficient combo game going for them. They have less attacks for that, and less focus. They're more focused on countering after a dodge.

    Ofc swiftness and blitz shouldn't stack, since both of them gives dodge rate, just in case we don't make fighters even more OP than they are now.

    Well, in this scenario, Swiftness wouldn't give dodge at all. It'd be a 5-seconds invincibility buff(at max lvl), with the last 2/3 seconds you being able to move/attack. And dodge doesn't stack well with invincibility. :P

    Completely agree with this, a 25% (for example) of speed instead of 20% would be more than enough, Pokos give 25% and are the only ones that can make a fighter (and the rest of humans) reach their max of speed. A figher should have this by himself. The dodge part, doesn't seem that necessary to be honest, and as much as I would love the buff, is not necessary.

    What good would a higher speed boost do? You can already reach max speed with perfect gear+SSJ due to the cap only being 100ms, and in PvP it remains pointless thanks to Thunder alone giving max speed. Of course if it gave dodge rate, people would just spam it without purpose. Fighters have a lot of RNG as is, which is a big source of frustration for both players when their dodges do/don't work. Replacing swiftness' huge DEX+dodge boost for a few seconds of invincibility is a big step already to turn RNG into skillful play.

    I think that would be the best for all players, HSN gets bleed, SHSN gets crit bonus but from behind but the base % dmg is reduced a bit.

    I've added an alternative bleed needle suggestion with stats I think should work in theory. Lemme know what you think.

  • Well echo, since there is already shit tons of dex, since there is %res accessory that gives fighters already tons of resistance, giving them any more resistance or resistance buffs is bad, we would get broken class that is immune to everything.


    I agree with most of things but I will never agree with giving resistance to fighters, only 1 resistance king should be Ultimate Majin.

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  • Well echo, since there is already shit tons of dex, since there is %res accessory that gives fighters already tons of resistance, giving them any more resistance or resistance buffs is bad, we would get broken class that is immune to everything.


    I agree with most of things but I will never agree with giving resistance to fighters, only 1 resistance king should be Ultimate Majin.

    Huh? I never suggested to add extra resistance on Blitz Fist. I'm saying dodge would make it a mindless skill for people to spam since Blitz Fist's only has 40 seconds CD. You can alter that cooldown to be longer, but it would kill it's early-game/solo-SSJ purposes, and we're trying to get away from overpowered RNG in favor of viable options anyway.

    In my opinion, Blitz Fist granting 1 RP ball(at max lvl anyway, it shouldn't be free) would make more sense.

  • This is basically a fighter's options:

    66d6d06025.jpg

    Difficult choice, am I right?


    Fighters have potential to be very timing/skill based and add a lot of fast pacing to matches if these suggestions were to get implemented. It'd make things interesting for sure, rather than have so many one-trick wonder moments where they pray to RNGesus and somehow miraculously come out on top like an Ultra Instinct GOD and frustrate both themselves and their opponent because it's just luck, or get absolutely destroyed when they DO end up getting hit just once by a bold strike or something - because they probably have no CON since DEX is overpowered as hell.


    Instead of relying on RNG, there could be timing - there could be feinting, as listed before. If you're predictable, you're going to get your ass kicked by a Fighter. That's /good/ stuff, imo. There should be a class that punishes people for playing one exact same way every time and winning...


    9ce55d1781.jpg


    *cough*


    But at the same time, it shouldn't be totally down to a luck of the draw. If it's timing based, this gives options to both sides - you can trick a Fighter into using their guaranteed invincibility by cancelling out an animation midway, or other ways, meaning things become all about reading your opponent in these matchups. Fighter vs Fighter would become absolutely crazy, because it's no longer "who stuns/crits first wins", it'd be all about positioning and psyching each other out.


    For the current standard of the game and its balancing? That'd be amazing stuff.

  • Six in one match, yes, but that's besides the point. I play a Turtle anyway lmao, this is for making Fighter more fun for both players involved after all! I think being able to dodge Bold Strike from someone that's just mindlessly spamming it would be more than fair enough, or other predictable moves like I dunno, a Quick Attack or something. It'd change the whole way Martial Artists fight each-other if a Fighter can suddenly guaranteed dodge a Quick Attack, a lot more thought would have to be put into the game.


    Right now, it's pretty much...


    Quick Attack -> Roar -> Maybe one extra buff -> Kidney Shot -> HS Needle -> SHS Needle -> Hoping that RNG stops you from dying -> Repeat


    Usually one of the needles will crit at least, but even still, that's luck. All of it is. That's bad.

  • wait for CCBD F150 to be added and you will see OP fighters that doesn't die from one hit.

  • The point of fighter being OP is just about they can easily 1 shot everyone due to high dex (that results in high crit rate) and insane thunder speed.

    In cap 70 you can't rly kill fighters with just 1 skill but they can 1 shot u and if u run they even have insane 10 meters range (swordsman only has 3 meters for example). Just nerf fighters max crit damage (like 60% of enemy max hp) so they r not able to 1 shot.

    Here's an example of a party with 2 insane fighters on DBOTW1.



  • swordsman has flash,flash slash, focused gravity break and burning attack which has medium/long range.

    at level 70 cap with good equips + green cc aura + prop you can't get 1 hit killed with fighter,the only problem fighter class has is many noobs play with it with no experience just clicking 4 buttons stuns and needles.in my opinion fighters need to be modified to not only use 2 needles and use other chained combo.

  • The last reply was more than 365 days ago, this thread is most likely obsolete. It is recommended to create a new thread instead.

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