Revert Buff removal on dungeon enter/party leave

Honestly speaking the adjustment is just wrong if you look at those points.

Quote from Tempest

It did not make much sense for a party to take a whole part of the ultimate/chef skill set (the core buffs which is arguably the most important part of the skill set) without these classes being present inside the actual dungeon.

Yes that's sadly right

Quote from Tempest

Many players who mained buffing classes complained that they were useless due to everyone leveling up their own personal private buffer

This still won't change people will still take their own personal buffer. It's still better than taking a random buffer who will just be afk in the whole dungeon like your own personal buffer.

Quote from Tempest

This was to help encourage a more different variety of classes within parties to be formed instead of the generic shadow knight, poko, dende, karma + extra standard party.

Now the party will look like sk, poko, dende, karma, ultimate. This just created a fixed party not a different variety of classes within parties. As long as crit dmg is not a thing this party won't change.

My problem with this change is just it does not fix anything. It just forces people to take an ultimate with them but this ultimate will still be a friend or a private buffer. I know we have the problem that buffers won't find a party but that's sadly how dbo designed buffer they have no dmg and are only a support class. So they are literally useless in runs where you just want to spam something.

Well only reason why people even complain it is because dual client is possible.

I mean go check other MMO and you will see that there are people with 1 or 2 characters without dual client thing.

You guys can complain how much you want about this but as long dual client is possible, people won't even consider to main anything else that core classes and that is why this game is dieing out

Fix dual client, no AFK Token abuse, no one man party taking dungeons, it will be team play and people will work on their characters beside "human PVP" classes shits as you can see now.

On - topic: No this shouldn't be done, let majins have chance to get BID's stuffs.

Quote from Vadim

No matter what he does, multiclient will be done anyways, either through a second pc/laptop or virtual machines.
Majins have a chance of getting items, I mean in POB my ultima had full kraken/cell stuff.
And now its basically turned the other way, you have to take an ultima (sidenote ultima is better than grandma, so only ultimas profit from this change) and all fighters/sm (which are much more than ultima and grandma) wont be in parties for sure.

Yes if you look it that way and this is only because speed party is mandatory.

If NTL never made this shit as attack speed, we wouldn't even discuss about this.

Still I see your point but I am sure you see mine too, I am sick of HUMANS BallZ Online game, sick of it!

Quote from Vadim

It was, and always will remain like this. Most people play it because of super saiyan and the abilities which are close to anime/games.
There's not much you can do against that, so I don't really see why forcing people into that role.

And what I mostly dislike is the fact that freedom is getting taken away, it's a game and in my opinion we shouldn't have restrictions like that since they ruin variety and this takes fun away.

Freedom is taken away in start of game soon classes, party roles are set.

In each MMO there is always TANK, DPS, SUPPORT...

I am sure you play more games than me and you saw this soo tell me, is it normal for 1 player to play on 5 accounts and do dungeon alone?

I never saw this in any MMO, I am team player and I love to play with PEOPLE, if I want to play like that, I wouldn't play "online" game lel.

Still don't get me wrong, I am not fan of this even tho I dislike multi client thing, but there should be way that each class can be part of party in any BID or CC.

If revert back would lead to that, I am up for it.

Quote from Iceman

Freedom is taken away in start of game soon classes, party roles are set.

In each MMO there is always TANK, DPS, SUPPORT...

I am sure you play more games than me and you saw this soo tell me, is it normal for 1 player to play on 5 accounts and do dungeon alone?

I never saw this in any MMO, I am team player and I love to play with PEOPLE, if I want to play like that, I wouldn't play "online" game lel.

Still don't get me wrong, I am not fan of this even tho I dislike multi client thing, but there should be way that each class can be part of party in any BID or CC.

If revert back would lead to that, I am up for it.

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Personal opinion:

If only one client is available, people who are not Karma/Poko/Dende/SK/Ultimate won't have the chance to play dungeons, because right now, those are the classes that simply work for the "perfect speed party". If you create a human, a Chef or a DW you won't be invited. And of course a party without a Ultimate, Dende and Tank, are impossible(talking about making a party where everyone has the same level of the dungeon). That leaves with 2 spots available which end up being the Poko (speed) and Karma (speed) to make the party easier.

Quote from Vadim

The only reason for this change was BIDS but did you ever consider cc150?
The first party to clear CC150 must have an ultima with them. After the first runs you can substitute the 5th player, but never the buffer.
He might be bad for BIDS, but so is fighter, SM, Plasma. Ultima is a pretty decent open world stone/gear/db farmer and not only a buffbot.

Ultima is good for budokai, cc, open world farming and just bad for bids because you want to clear them as fast as possible.

Since when should one class be good for everything? Classes have their strengths and weaknesses, and BIDS might be one weakness but buffers have their strengths, and are a must have for higher CC runs.

We can debate like this, 4ever.

Like I said, I am not fan of this idea, but buffers mains complain regarding this, they were "useless".

Still if would this lead for more options regarding use of other classes and in BID's would for sure, then I am up for it.

for bids i think that double buffer speed party could bee a great idea .

people are saying that buffer is usless , let mee tell you somthing i'am kinda sure all buffers u have been with in instance's dosn't play buffer's as supposed to bee , for example buffer can taunt the boss with mobs and use speed boots and run all over the map while all the other player's shoot the boss !

secondly the buffer can go kidbuu and deal way more damge then a turtle ( if he have prop set ) , finnaly buffer can play as alternative TANK or support remouving debuffs and protect the dende

know for mee the main problem with this is exp char ! i think @EXPOFF command should allow u to not char exp with the other's .

another problem is if the Buffer got a DC in cc it's the end daneos have to deal with this specialy for the CC !

I can already tell for cell a party of : poko , karma, turtle, dende, and another dps, the dende will be substituted for a buffer at the start to buff then switched back because dende do not really do much dps the begin with. Also, cell can be done without a dende.

Quote from Tempest

• This was to help encourage a more different variety of classes within parties to be formed instead of the generic shadow knight, poko, dende, karma + extra standard party.

Many players felt other classes were abusing the duration of the ultimate and chef classes, which was why some members of the community demanded for this mechanic to be changed.

Riiight. So according to that logic the "optimal party setup" can be SK+Poko+Dende+Karma, with the Ultimate replacing the Turtle. Face it, the issue was crap balancing. Poko+Karma is too good to miss out on thanks to their attack+movement speed buffs, which now also buffs the buffer's spin! Not only have you made humans even WORSE of an option to take along, you made it even MORE necessary to take the infamous Karma+Poko combination. Except now they're dominant on lower level caps too, BEFORE attack speed becomes huge. Thanks for that!

Buffers were always viable in all dungeons thanks to their support skills, taunts, tankiness, AoE spins and Pure Majin attack speed. They're even completely necessary in high level CC runs. The only people who'd actively refuse to take a buffer along would be dickish randoms. Yet because a few buffers felt the sting of rejection that Swordsmen and Cranes ALWAYS got, they deserved this entire change, despite the obnoxious side-effects it gets us and how it limits party combinations even MORE??

Quote from Iceman

Fix dual client, no AFK Token abuse, no one man party taking dungeons, it will be team play and people will work on their characters beside "human PVP" classes shits as you can see now.

1-man teams taking down dungeons? How many people have you even seen capable of that? You've just got a personal vendetta here....

...besides, it's impossible. VPNs, proxies, virtual machines, there's always a way to dual-client. The original DBO tried to stop it, it failed as well.

Quote from kidunseen

I can already tell for cell a party of : poko , karma, turtle, dende, and another dps, the dende will be substituted for a buffer at the start to buff then switched back because dende do not really do much dps the begin with. Also, cell can be done without a dende.

you played POB bro ? ( it's just a question )

No one at lvl 70 will let his buffer being afk in serious party because now with his spin or kidbuu he can do real damage.

Quote from TheProdige

you played POB bro ? ( it's just a question )

yes, tw 2.5 years

Quote from kidunseen

yes, tw 2.5 years

i know i can see that u are great pve player ( same as most of the karin guilde) but my question was about Pre Open Beta not tw ...

Cuz you may get suprised with cell x and kraken changes !

Quote from Bad Picollo

No one at lvl 70 will let his buffer being afk in serious party because now with his spin or kidbuu he can do real damage.

The problem with buffer in speed run (not only speed parties just speed runs) is that they have pretty low phy atk compared to other classes. Yes the spin does a good dmg but compared to the other teammembers it's literally no dmg same for kidbuu. I even tried out kidbuu with max atk speed and it still sucks. It's just the phy atk that's not high enough to make him good in speed runs. But if you would increase his phy atk then his spin would do way to much dmg in PVP.

Quote from TheProdige

i know i can see that u are great pve player ( same as most of the karin guilde) but my question was about Pre Open Beta not tw ...

Cuz you may get suprised with cell x and kraken changes !

I tested a little of cell pob with dw tanking cell near wall and spam stunning / healing itself with skill no dende needed

Quote from kidunseen

I tested a little of cell pob with dw tanking cell near wall and spam stunning / healing itself with skill no dende needed

this was the Buggy method but the right one the mini cell's spawn's the circel's doesn't work same as taiwain so , in POB the cell x was by far the hardest boss