How DBOG can become a better game

  • And yet, here you are, some grown up man I see the most in forums spreading his selfishness and narcissism neglecting every person's opinion just because they haven't been grinding certain aspects of the game. I'd suggest you to start respecting other people's thoughts and accept the dilemma, that perhaps you're not always as right as you think you are.

    I know dbo is probably a playground for your expressiveness to satisfy the self importance that you may lack of, but what's obnoxious here, is this ridiculous act of a genius that is only one capable of seeing things clearly while the rest of people are blind and fail to see the perfection that maybe even you fool yourself with. It has lost it's humor.

    The question here is, why has this thread lost it's track so much. As far as I remember, there wasn't any announcements about a forum budokai and this thread is about the first post whatsoever. Seriously, what is this, a conflict party over a game? Cheers mates.

    I understand and respect other people's opinions 100%.

    However, when they start spreading their opinions as facts, and i strongly disagree with them, i become the bully.

    And they keep repeating the same things as ''facts'' over and over again, even if its not true at all, they are offended when i say they are having tunnel vision or extreme lack of top-game experience.

    But i dont care anymore, they can cry and feel victimized all day.


    Sigh, I started with the conversation with the intention to have a respectful and fruitful conversation. I've given my suggestions, and argued my points, yet all you've done is try to slander/straw-man me. Frankly, I find it both disgusting and funny. It really gets on my nerves that you're so darned arrogant that you can't even comprehend what I'm trying to say. You claim you can teach me how to beat Ultimate Majin, yet I haven't made a single post regarding Ultimate being impossible to beat. My WHOLE premise was that when scaling one class to another class in terms of how broken they are, Ultimate Majin would come out at #1. I don't believe Ultimate Majin is unbeatable, like I've said before I know multiple strategies certain classes could use to beat Ultimate Majin. But in most scenarios, Ultimate Majin would most likely have the advantage. Another thing I'd like to add is that you don't have to be unbeatable to receive a nerf: *cough Karma cough*

    Classes who have ways of dealing with ultimate majin, while having the advantage overall during the fight or battle for dice victory.


    Dark Warrior

    Shadow Knight

    Plasma Majin

    Karma Majin

    Grand Cheff Majin

    Turtle Hermit

    Crane hermit

    Dende Priest

    Poko priest



    Classes who get mauled by ultimate majin in current 60 cap

    Swordman

    Fighter


    HOWEVER.

    Ultimate majin can generally put up a fight against ANY class, not neccerarely have advantage during battle, but still put up a fight one way or another.

    But also that, is not exclusive to ultimate majins only.


    I dont mind if you guys say ultimate is hard cookie to kill, being it high stats from defences or resistance, it is a tanker class afterall.

    But its really annoying how all of you in the forum, just ignore plain weakspots that can be abused easely, such as short range skills, slow animations, low damage. Anything ultimate can do, most classes can counter play it one way or another.

    And if i say, that most of the forum users here, cannot do it, or dont know it, isn't me being arrogant.

    The fault useally lies with inexperience or lack of focus.


    Call me arrogant, biased, narcistic, noob or no-lifer, will not work.

  • HOWEVER.

    Ultimate majin can generally put up a fight against ANY class, not necessarily have advantage during battle, but still put up a fight one way or another.

    But also that, is not exclusive to Ultimate Majins only.

    Before we argue about the classes who have the "advantage" over a Ulti who can fight them somewhat equally, would you agree that Ultimate Majin has no concrete counter; A class that generally beats Ultimate Majins in most situations.


    And just to reply to the "i am the bully" comment, you were pretty much being a bully. Didn't even bother to try to acknowledge what I had to say, or try to combat my arguments the first couple of times with anything aside from "call me sensei". But that's besides the point, we're passed that stage(hopefully).


    Dark Warrior: In terms of beating UM their CCs are rendered completely useless(confuse resist% + para removal), neither party can kill each other. Trying to win by dice is virtually the only thing they can do, maybe they can manage to save a couple of RP balls for the end of the match to KD + bleed(although a perfectly timed senzu counters that) to win by health. As for how the Ultimate Majin can beat DW, they've got burn/Candy(with Duration RP if they need to) with the addition of the same long range KD that DW have. Theoretically if the DW is perfectly geared, they could switch to burn def gear to diminish the ulti's burn and senzu bean. I would imagine in most cases both the Ulti and DW would be evenly matched(Dice decides winner) if both players are skilled.


    Plasma Majin: I don't know why you bothered placing this on the list, if DBOG's "top" Karmas such as Horrid can barely defeat you, I don't see why any Plasma in existence would stand a chance against Ultimate Majin. If the Plasma SOMEHOW manages to survive until the end(which I'd imagine in most scenarios they won't), then MAYBE they can win by dice. However in most cases the Ultimate Majin would have a large advantage over the Plasma. With confusion resist% they've rendered almost all of their CCs useless, KD spam without CCs is hardly a threat, and naturally killing the Ulti isn't even an option for the Plasma. Ulti has the advantage.


    Karma Majin: Karma is hardly a counter for Ultimate Majin, throughout the fight the Karma is forced to be on the defensive just so that they don't end up being killed by the UM. Karma has 2 tactics in order to beat a skilled UM, that's either to KD them out, or to win by dice; Killing the UM naturally isn't an option(Even if they wear dex). During the match the UM can wear dex because they don't need props to tank the Karma's damage, and they don't need to worry about confusion taking care of them as they won't die, that leaves Skill lock as their only viable tactic against them. While UM with full dex is capable of resisting 40%(approximately) of all CCs that a Full focus Karma dishes out, and if they resist their skill lock the Karma is forced into a position where the Ulti can damage them as much as they want for a little. Since the KM will be using Focus armor that lowers their health to the point where UM has the opportunity of killing them. So in terms of trying to win by dice/survive Ultimate's definitely got the advantage. When it comes to them trying to KD the UM, I would argue that the UM still has the advantage in that regard, solely due to resist though. Assuming that the Karma lands their slow, their KDs, and Skill lock in that theoretically perfect scenario the Karma can KD them out. However, that's if they manage to force the UM near the edge, and have their KDs/CCs/slow ready at the same time. It's not easy to pull off as the Karma is still trying to control the fight in a way that the UM doesn't get the chance to just obliterate them. Ulti definitely has the advantage against Karma Majin.


    Grand Chef: Ulti and Grand are pretty much equivalent when they fight each other. Neither can kill each other, nor can KD themselves outside the arena; Thus the match is decided by dice.


    Poko Priest: Although I'm not too well versed in Poko, I'd imagine most scenarios would end up being decided by dice. I don't see UM or Poko killing each other, and if it's a matter of keeping their health up, neither party struggles in that department. However, I will argue that Poko would have the slight disadvantage because of their EP. If the UM focus fire the Poko rather than wait for the timer to run out, theoritically they can force the Poko to keep healing until they run out of EP. However, I'm not 100% certain how that would be work over the span of 3 minutes, but I bet the UM can more than likely pull off a kill(although I reckon it's rare, and you'd have to go under the assumption they wouldn't just use pills as a substitute to manage their EP). I'd say they're just about equal.


    Dende Priest: Pretty much the same scenario as Poko, however UM wouldn't be able to kill the Dende under any circumstance(nor would they have EP issues). Battle of dice, they're just about even, however UM has long ranged KD and burn that they can use to screw with the Dende last second.


    Crane Hermit: Crane Hermit is essentially a downgraded version of Turtle Hermit against Ultimate Majin. They can try to KD the ulti out, but since they have to charge for their RP, 1 out of their 2 usable KDs runs on success rate rather than hit rate putting them at a disadvantage when compared to Turtle. They also can't spam their KDs continuously like Turtle can without sleeping their opponent after 3 KDs. When it comes to damaging the Ulti, I wouldn't necessarily say they have it worse than Turtle Hermit. Turtle Hermit already does trash damage against Ultimate Majins, but if you use burn defense right before your sleep ends(to force them to use Solid burn with power RP) you'll make it hard for them to land enough burns, because they also have to spend the majority of their RP balls on KD. However it isn't impossible to kill the Ultimate Majin either, you can even argue that they have it better than Turtle in regards to damaging the Ulti. However generally I'd imagine the Ulti can survive for over 3 minutes with the use Autopots/Senzu beans. Crane TECHNICALLY has the advantage, but they're not a concrete counter as it can be a struggle as a Crane to kill Ultimates.


    Turtle Hermit: Killing the UM isn't an option, and even if they magically manage to land 100% of their Slows/KDs/Sleeps tbey still have to worry about Ultimate Majins removing their debuffs in order to become mobile again. In theory if the Ulti wears move% boots, they can still tank the Turtle's attacks pretty efficiently on top of managing to prevent the Turtle from knocking them off the arena. In order to land all their CCs the Turtle Hermit has to go full Focus(rip their health), but if they don't give up their success rate neck/focus rings the Ulti can still candy them from afar. If it's still possible, maybe they can try to sleep lock the Ulti throughout the match in order to win via dice. But I'd imagine most cases where they go for KD, it'd only give the Ultimate an opening to land a solid cluster bomb that'd mess them up real bad(They also have less defense than Karma, as they're humans). But due to their high success rate of landing all their sleeps, lets say that they're equivalent to Ultimate Majin. Ulti has survivability, while Turtle Hermit has high success rate to keep them locked in place.


    Shadow Knight: Finally, the last class I have left to cover. Even if you use pretty much the best strat against Ulti which is to go full focus, and CD in order to spam Taunt debuffs and their other debuffs, generally the Ulti won't lose. Going Full Focus, and CD would only render you defenseless against the Ultimate's absurd damage as seen with Pram vs Skedar.

    The only way for SK to defeat Ultimate Majin(with good gear) in DBOG was to use the arm pull KD strat, which Daneos removed from the game. If it weren't for Sendoku abusing the Arm-KD strategy, Skedar would've squashed him with no problems at all. Ultimates are very tanky(virtually unkillable), they resist A LOT(as seen in the Sendoku fight, and from what I've heard about Karma vs Ultis), and without KD, SK can't do anything against Ulti aside from use lp% and hope that they don't need to use senzu until last second.


    Thus in conclusion, the only class in the entire game with any real form of advantage against Ulti is Crane Hermit. Dark Warrior, Turtle Hermit, Grand Chef, Poko, and Dende are capable of just about fighting "evenly" against Ulti. While Ulti is beatable by Karma, generally they have a concrete advantage over them in a fight, and Plasma Majins/MAs don't stand an inch of a chance.


    Just an extra note, but aside from Crane(whose attacks bypass phy/eng defense) that struggles heavily to kill Ulti, none of the other classes even come close to killing Ultimate Majin. Unkillable + no concrete counter; The only way to win is by dice or KDing them out if you can(Which you won't accomplish most of the time).

  • I agree to everything you said but the arm pull strategy wasn't the onlu way to beat an Ultimate. it would still be possible to kill an Ulti if lifesteal did not receive a change. Although an Ulti would probably easily resist it that was still one reason SKS could actually stand a chance against Ultis. Atm all an Ulti has to do is use full enegery defense gear and It's game over.

  • Resistance vs Focus




    Karma/plasma

    With focus, you will succes around 90% of debuffs.

    You can just spam knockdowns from a distance, ultimate short ranged / slow animation attacks wont reach you.

    Karma has advantage of skill locks.

    Plasma has buff that gives 309 burn defence

    Both are excelent at knockdown spam from a distance.


    Turtle/crane

    With enough focus, debuffs will hardly miss.

    So for them too, they need more then 1 defence set ;)

    All thats required, is debuffs, slow and keep distance, and ultima wont be able to give them much trouble.


    Poko/Dende

    you will win ANY draw/dice endgame.

    Antenna beam can interupt anything ulti can try.

    Also your knockdown animation is far faster then anything ulti has to offer.


    Cheff.

    All cheff needs to do, is gather RP during the match.

    At the last half a minute, switch to focus and cooldown. Spam EP drain.

    Ultima EP will litterally be 0. GG


    Dark Warrior

    All Dark Warrior needs to do, is save stuns, confusion and RP for the end.

    IF ultima goes full anti confusion, u can stun him, bleed and use long range knockdown, so that he cannot remove the bleed.

    If he goes anti stun, you can confuse him, knockdown, do w.e u want.


    Shadowknight.

    All SK has to do , is have 2 defence sets , LP % and focus.

    Time your debuffs with your focus set, gain RP for knocdowns and spam debuffs, drain, curse and bolds.

    Ofcourse you have to time everything with the mountain of CC's you have.


    Seriously, if you main any of these chars, and you are equipped/experienced good enough with any of these, getting raped by a ultimate majin is just sad.

    Just because majins have high defences, and they can go to a draw, doesnt mean they are fighting ''evenly''


    Why do you think 0 ultima's except me, have ever won solo budokai since we came out of open beta?

    And there are several ultima's out there who outgear me.


    Fight, learn, adapt, become better player, but stop the whining over something that already good players have already overcome before you.

  • Resistance vs Focus


    Allow me to first say this, my objective isn't to whine simply because I can't beat Ultimate Majins. Like I said before, I was once an Ultimate Majin when I used to play; My objective is to narrow down the factors that support my thesis to try to convince YOU and the community(they're just a bonus, though). And I don't care that you're the only Ultimate Majin to have won budokai, we're discussing these thought experiments under the assumption both parties have the best possible gear and are highly skilled. I saw your resist video, but I have a testimony from a Karma acquaintance who claims that you were able to resist approximately 40% of their CCs with your dex/confuse resist% set up. When it comes to resisting confusion, most players(or all the players that I've talked to actually) claim that confuse resist% renders confusion nearly useless.


    Shadow Knight: You can't switch 2+ pieces of armor constantly before you attack(especially if you're using CD), it takes a bit of time depending on your ping(You can't switch during an attack animation either). If we push aside the fact that SK CAN get killed by Ultimate Majin(very easily if they use full focus 100% of the time), there's also no way in hell a SK's going to deal 3+ health bars of damage vs a Ulti. Like I've said countless of times killing geared Ultimates isn't possible if you're not a Crane.


    Grand Chef: Perfectly timed senzu renders any last health/EP attacks virtually pointless. In theory, Grand could maybe pull a win like that against Ulti during 60 cap of Retail when it was OP, but not in the current stage of DBOG. Furthermore, that's under the assumption the Ulti just stands there and takes it. I think it'd be fair to assume that the Ulti would also charge their RP in order to use candy(with duration RP if needed), and KD to win last second.


    Dark Warrior: It's almost like you've missed the entire segment I made about confusion resist%, it works wayy differently than using full dex against the Turtle you fought. From my sources, it renders confusion virtually useless, and then there's paralysis removal. Their CCs are useless against Ulti. DW doesn't have a stun, they have para/confusion. Their only bleed has cast time, so by the time their attack hits, the Ulti would've removed the paralysis, and began to remove the bleed before using senzu.


    Poko/Dende Priest: I can imagine Poko's long range KD being quicker than Ultis, however Dendes don't have long ranged KDs. Even if they did, a timed senzu renders their attempts to lower your health useless.


    Turtle Hermit/Crane: Sure, I agree that they just have to keep their distance. But the problem with them going full focus is anti-candy, if they wear anti-candy it takes away a little from their Succ rate. Depending on how the Ulti starts the match, they can manage to land multiple hard hits on them, with the addition of having their combos interrupted with candy if they go full Focus. But most of the time the match will be decided by dice.


    You never replied to my question that I wanted answered concerning Ultimates counters: Does Ultimate have any concrete counters it generally CAN'T beat?

  • Perhaps this is presumptuous of me to conclude. But if you still have objections, I'm willing to listen. Wouldn't it be logical to conclude that because Ultimate can't be killed by any class aside from Crane, and doesn't have any concrete counters justify it as being "broken" when scaled to top tier classes?


    Shadow Knight - Hard countered by Ultimate Majin, Dende, and Karma Majin.

    Dende - Hard countered by Karma Majin, Turtle Hermit, and Crane

    Karma Majin - Hard countered by Swordsmen

    Ultimate Majin - Hard countered by virtually nothing


    Now if I were to suggest changes that can be made to balance Ultimate Majin, it'd start with removing the self-removal effect that's on their paralysis/stun removal abilities. I don't see why the creators decided it was a good idea to even make Ultimate's CC removal ability applicable to themselves while they're CC'd, while the other classes don't have this effect. Aside from that, I'd pretty much leave Ultimate Majin alone. I think it's a fair change to make Ulti moderately less obnoxious without "killing" the class. Maybe even nerf their damage significantly, however I'd make their skill animations a lot faster to balance the nerf with a buff.

  • Shadow Knight - Hard countered by Ultimate Majin, Dende, and Karma Majin.

    Dende - Hard countered by Karma Majin, Turtle Hermit, and Crane

    Karma Majin - Hard countered by Swordsmen

    Ultimate Majin - Hard countered by virtually nothing

    This is merely your opinion, but its far from the truth


    1. what your karma friend says or does is completely irrilevant. My video shows it all, and a karma has more focus.

    2. It takes less then a second to switch 2 pieces of armor.

    3. a good SK will never be killed by a ultimate, or a karma for that matter

    4. about DW, you can wear 94% confuse resisistance, but you will have no anti stun or anti bleed, and if you time your KD /stun good you WILL win the draw/dice game.


    5. About concrete counters it cant beat 100%?

    Allow me to reply :D

    You think a fully equipped, and experienced SK, DW, Karma ,cheff have concrete counters they cant beat 100%? :S

    The answer is no.

    Does ulti have overwhelming advantage in pvp in many matchs up like karma/sk do? answer is no aswell.


    I think best solution is, you login your ultima or a ultima from your friend.

    And i let you pvp against some friends of mine, see what happens when reality kicks in. ^^

  • Even though I was very sceptical on why is Skedar in the balancement team, I always admired that he really pays attention to every single small thing in the game.


    Cashalot The issue people having is the way to counter them. You call us bad at the game, you make it seem like we are worms compared to you just because we don't reach as high as you. Bare in mind that while YOU as an ultimate majin had no issues getting full +15 CC100 massively boxed sets, a DW / Plasma / Crane / Chef might have some issues having.


    This game is NOT only about PvP, you have Budokai and Scramble, both dead at the moment, because scramble is not even fun with the low amount of players, and Budokai is 60% of the time having someone who crashes the opponent, that was proven yesterday.


    You said that a turtle with lots of focus and 2 sets can beat an ultimate, fair enough, if you have successrate, you're godlike, so that way i'd actually replace 1 focus armor with a successrate necklace, though. You YOURSELF made it seem like that it's easy as that, but is it? Turtles have hard time having balanced defense against an ultimate, because you can snap out from stun, you can start spinning if you see the sleep animation, you can eat the debuffs you have (also spam this with CD) and also have 2 KD moves without having to ruin your build, while a male turtle has to actually hit these debuffs to stand a little bit of chance. What if the turtle is massively maxed with focus and still you manage to resist a stun or sleep? The game is over.

    What if you fail a candy or a cluster and the turtle survives for 10 sec longer? Nothing, because the arsenal, defense, and attack varies you have is way too high compared to almost every other class.

    Oh and also if you see the turtle casting sleep, you can time it just right and start spinning before it finishes, so you also wasted one of the core debuffs for a turtle.


    You also said that every class has a weak spot that can be abused. Fair enough, but ultimate has the capablity to abuse those even harder, than any of them abusing ultimate, that's where your logic is flawed.

    An ultimate with a gear like YOURS should 90% of the time win EVERY 1v1, don't be delusional and think that we have the exact same gear set as you. The ones who have been able to beat you are either similar or close as geared as you, being able to hit strong crits on you.



    I know for a fking fact that you will quote this message and try to justify how godlike you are compared to me, as you do with everyone else, but I really really have to quote this :


    It really gets on my nerves that you're so darned arrogant that you can't even comprehend what I'm trying to say.


    This is exactly how almost everyone who ever argued with you feels like, you YOURSELF seem to understand that aswell, because your own friends turned against you, not because you're better than them / us, but because the insanely high level of arrogance and egoism you show.


    Making it seem like we're worthless compared to you and then calling us garbage will not make your points valid.


    How about you turn back to my first post and do as I said, and get down from your massive horse and understand that not everyone is as skilled and geared as you? Most of these players have no idea what actual attributes do, what do they attack and defend against, what attributes are better in which circumstances, what animation is there on skills, how you can react to certain stuff.

    Skedar, you're an adult man, you should understand that the way you act and talk to us makes us feel belittled, while you act like a god amongst the peasants.



    And with this, I'm done talking / arguing with you, as it is clearly pointless, and this thread was not made for that purpose.


    How to make this game better? Get a better community that teaches the players, not belittle them. End of story.

  • Even though I was very sceptical on why is Skedar in the balancement team, I always admired that he really pays attention to every single small thing in the game.

    thats true, but im not the only one who pays attention to details to find weak points to exploit , or to get the advantage one way or another.

    You said that a turtle with lots of focus and 2 sets can beat an ultimate, fair enough, if you have successrate, you're godlike, so that way i'd actually replace 1 focus armor with a successrate necklace, though. You YOURSELF made it seem like that it's easy as that, but is it? Turtles have hard time having balanced defense against an ultimate, because you can snap out from stun, you can start spinning if you see the sleep animation, you can eat the debuffs you have (also spam this with CD) and also have 2 KD moves without having to ruin your build, while a male turtle has to actually hit these debuffs to stand a little bit of chance. What if the turtle is massively maxed with focus and still you manage to resist a stun or sleep? The game is over.

    What if you fail a candy or a cluster and the turtle survives for 10 sec longer? Nothing, because the arsenal, defense, and attack varies you have is way too high compared to almost every other class.

    Oh and also if you see the turtle casting sleep, you can time it just right and start spinning before it finishes, so you also wasted one of the core debuffs for a turtle.

    High level turtle would stop casting sleep as soon the ultimate is foolish enough to start spinning.

    As for the KD's ultimate's have, both skills animation is so slow, it makes bold strike looks quick.

    Secondly, even if you were to allow ultima to get RP, and be able to knockdown you, you're doing something wrong by getting in hes face so close.

    Turtles have a secret weapon vs ulti's, besides sleep. its called debuffs,slow and knockdown spam from a distance.

    You also said that every class has a weak spot that can be abused. Fair enough, but ultimate has the capablity to abuse those even harder, than any of them abusing ultimate, that's where your logic is flawed.

    An ultimate with a gear like YOURS should 90% of the time win EVERY 1v1, don't be delusional and think that we have the exact same gear set as you. The ones who have been able to beat you are either similar or close as geared as you, being able to hit strong crits on you.



    I know for a fking fact that you will quote this message and try to justify how godlike you are compared to me, as you do with everyone else, but I really really have to quote this :

    i respect your opinion, and you are right about a few things, i dont think most people have the accoires and gears i have collected, specificly to give me the best chances i can possible have to fight in almost any pvp situation. i litterally have over 3 z32 bags filled with items for pvp.


    And yes EVERY class have weakspots, that can be abused, but it doesnt mean that every class can be killed easely, theres a difference.

    I can fight players that has gears, accoires like me, but i wont be able to kill ppl like that most of the time. unless they are MA. :P

    Its like i told others too, if you truly believe ultimate to be so overpowered, then login a ultimate or borrow one, and i will let you pvp a few friends of mine

    And just see what happens, instead of debating here and getting angry with me, but i predict some ppl eyes will be opened.


  • Thank you for clearing up some of the doubts I had, glad to see a response with actual argument. I myself have an Ultimate majin, but I truthfully found it really boring after a while, as I am only very experienced with Turtles, hence why I used turtle as an example instead of anything else (because if you remember, I played male turtle for years).


    Turtles might have other advantages such as slow and kd, but KD requires RP, slow can be eaten (with cd rp also even faster) and a male turtle bleeds out there. Females are different story, I give you that. But we have to consider all outcomes, not only potential ones.

  • Please, you really believe DW's paralysis stands a chance against Ultimate Majin? A DW's bleed/paralysis was never a threat to begin with, if they use paralysis > removed, bleed > removed, Confusion > resisted. At best DW is equivalent to Ultimate, but definitely not superior.


    Yes, I genuinely believe that classes for example SK have concrete counters it can't beat even with perfect gear. A good SK CAN be killed by a relatively strong Karma Majin, as long as they don't use props they're killable. If they switch to Props, then confusion will deal with them accordingly, that's why Karma Majins stomp SKs generally. The SK stands a slight chance if they had the attribute advantage, but for the sake of fairness, I won't include that as a variable. Sure, it takes less than a second to change equipment(per piece). But here's the issue with that, when you're using CD/Focus your attacks are going to be far more spamable than they are usually. Since you can't switch in the middle of an attack animation, you'd be forced to constantly wait a couple of seconds to change your gear after every combo. After a while it reaches a point where you probably would've done more damage sticking to Focus and just accepting your death, rather than actually bother to switch between for survivability.


    Bout that resistance video, can I have your word that the Turtle Hermit wasn't using Karma Buff, or anything of the sort?(If possible, maybe record another video? If you won't, I'll just take your word for it). I noticed that you were locked on yourself throughout the entire video, and the Turtle magically landed nearly every CC/Debuff; While Horrid was having trouble landing his CCs against Skedar(resisted 35-40%). Besides even if the video was 100% legitimate, I wouldn't consider stalling for time real counter play against Ulti. At some point the Ultimate WILL resist, and when they do, they'll eviscerate the Turtle Hermit. If you check the video below, you'll notice a huge dodge difference between his resist video, and the fight against Nemesis. Without any dodge buff he has approximately 860 dodge, but in the video he had only 904 WITH his dodge buff(Perhaps I'm wrong to assume that you maxed your dodge buff?).


    Here's a video of CodeNemesis vs Skedar: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIP5cc14dU95qPz8DekZuTA (I couldn't post the video, because it was censored, weird. Just check his most recent video) The problem with going full Focus, like I said multiple times is Ultimate's CC, they can very easily interrupt the Turtle's CCs. In addition to that there's the issue of survivability, despite wearing con Skedar managed to lower his health quite rapidly; If he were wearing Focus the entire time, he'd have gotten squashed np. Fun fact, guard level 3 increases resist dramatically. Even players like Horrid have problems dealing against those with maxed guard. In most scenarios, the Turtle Hermit is forced to start off with Con(otherwise they'll die), and because of that the chances of them sleeping the Ulti lowers drastically. After the 1st round of exchange, the Turtle will more than likely have had their auto-pot activate. Once that's occurred, it's just a matter of time before the Turtle screws something up(resist, mistake, dodge, etc) until the Ulti wins.

  • ^I highly doubt it. It's strange how you never actually locked on to the turtle. It's not hard to tell where my suspicion is coming from. I know you go to great lenghts to prove your point so I won't be as generous as others to take your word for anything.

    thats rich, coming from someone like you :S

    But dont worry, im not like you, so i'm actually telling the truth.

  • OH OH AHAHAAH WTF IS GOING ON IN THIS THREAD, I JUST WANT REMIND EVERONE ABOUT WHAT THIS THREAD IS :

  • The last reply was more than 365 days ago, this thread is most likely obsolete. It is recommended to create a new thread instead.

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