Posts by ExaltedGeico

    Removing kd from MSS is a huge mistake. Energy recovery now saves 4sp not sure about cd but i used to max energy recovery. Evade up is useless since you wont run out of ep after succesfull combos. Making SS main knockdown is only making sm use more sp cuz you will still max MSS for more dmg. Dmg from back reduced just bc karma class looked too op for them which affected swordsman aswell. So like i said swordaman lost more sp, dmg and really good combos actually class is at its weakest right now. Not sure who decided theae changes but their out of their god damn minds!

    From my experience if you wanna spam KD, I think SS is a superior move than MSS. SS has a shorter CD; thus making it far more spamable than MSS. With the buffed RP recov move, you could in theory more easily knock someone out of the arena. Or at least that's what I took from the change, you're going to need to test the strategy out-- assuming that you KD your opponents out. But to be honest, if you're going to fight a Ulti, your best option is to knock them out.

    Lack of KD? I'm fairly certain SS now has KD instead of MSS. Regardless, they still have an solid damage dealing attack that has KD RP. I understand if you complained about SM not having enough SP, but why's KD an issue? And from what I can tell about the changes made with the Dex Buff, KD, and CD buff they're really pressing SM with skills that drain your SP. Perhaps this is their way of preparing for 70/80 cap, so SM can't max all their relevant moves(which they couldn't anyways).

    lol. the only upgrade here is energy recovery all others are nerfs lmao. Removing kd from MSS literally fvcked up this class. If you played swordsman well you should know how important it was. when stun becomes 0.0 you going to spam sword slashes lmao 400dmg to +15 tanks just wow. bring back kd to MSS

    now the fighter are going to cry, the fighter is fine like this, rather they do not know how to use it.

    "They do not know how to use it" Are you out of your mind? What's there not to know about using Fighter? Listen, it's one thing to not be creative/experimental with Fighter's fighting style(crit/prop, crit/dex, KD/CD, etc), but it's another thing to be "bad". Fighter is very straight-forward, and easy to comprehend class(for the most part). If the player has any form of experience playing the game I'm quite certain they'll "know how to use it".

    If your reasoning for why not a single Fighter has won budokai legitimately(despite it being one of the most popular classes in the entire game) is because "they don't know how to use it", then you simply don't know what you're talking about. Fighter, quite frankly can hardly compete against any non-human class. Dende/Ultimate/Grand Chef/SK/Karma obliterate them without a second thought, and Crane/Turtle I don't believe struggle with them much at all if they go full focus. As if right now Fighter/Plasma are the only two classes that don't hard counter any class in the entire game, thus objectively the worst classes in 1v1s. I won't bother covering their flaws in PvE because Echo already did so.

    because transformation can remove stun, confusion...

    It increases your health in %. That % can make the difference between beating critted to death by a Fighter, or tanking it and killing the Fighter with reflect/your attacks. For example you have 10k health, the Fighter's about to crit 12k, and then you use GN to hit 15k health -> clutch victory. In addition to it rendering the Fighter's attacks futile giving you the chance to make a comeback, it can also feel extremely satisfying to time it perfectly enabling you to obliterate them.

    Super Saiyan as the users above posted, is far superior in terms of its utility. It increases your damage, attack/movement speed, and your hit rate/dodge. The duration is unlimited so long as you don't run out of EP, change channels, or leave the server by either DCing/Logging out. It has virtually no repercussion on your stats while using it, and in PvP it can be useful in either Preliminary/Any match to break out of your opponents stun(although the 1 hour CD makes it a one-time thing in a match).

    Giant Namek on the other hand is very, very situational. Because of it's 10 minute duration limit, and 1 hour CD(30 minutes with capped CD), in addition to the attack/movement speed nerf it pales in comparison to SSJ in terms of utility. However, when the situation calls for it Giant Namekian can be superior to SSJ. For example if you're trying to tank a group of powerful mobs, along with their Boss you can transform into Giant Namekian. It doubles your physical/energy defense, increases your health by 1.5x(I may be wrong about that), in addition to the other buffs that SSJ gets(except for attack/movement speed).

    And unlike SSJ, Giant Namekian has its own relatively powerful AoE moves that accompany the transformation. "Kami's Destruction" attacks your target creating an aoe that affects mobs that surround your target within a 15 meter radius, and the lesser version of the first move which attacks in a straight column "Kami's frustation". Another purpose Giant Namekian serves is to allow non-tanks to tank, if you're a party full of DPS' and a Healer. Instances where the Poko isn't overpowered, they use Giant Namekian to not only deal greats amount of damage to entire hordes of minions, but also increase their survivability to the point where the bosses are virtually harmless to you.

    If you're bored/screwing around on platform, and your gloves/staff are powerful enough you can one shot players with relative ease using Kami's destruction just for the hell of it. You'd be surprised at how satisfying it is to slaughter players using Giant Namekian.

    Guard is accessible to just about anyone(who finished TLQ2), however level 3 on top of high dex increases the block/resist rate to absurd amounts.

    And Skedar, was the Turtle using only their own buffs, or not? I'm willing to take your word for it if you say so.

    Please, you really believe DW's paralysis stands a chance against Ultimate Majin? A DW's bleed/paralysis was never a threat to begin with, if they use paralysis > removed, bleed > removed, Confusion > resisted. At best DW is equivalent to Ultimate, but definitely not superior.

    Yes, I genuinely believe that classes for example SK have concrete counters it can't beat even with perfect gear. A good SK CAN be killed by a relatively strong Karma Majin, as long as they don't use props they're killable. If they switch to Props, then confusion will deal with them accordingly, that's why Karma Majins stomp SKs generally. The SK stands a slight chance if they had the attribute advantage, but for the sake of fairness, I won't include that as a variable. Sure, it takes less than a second to change equipment(per piece). But here's the issue with that, when you're using CD/Focus your attacks are going to be far more spamable than they are usually. Since you can't switch in the middle of an attack animation, you'd be forced to constantly wait a couple of seconds to change your gear after every combo. After a while it reaches a point where you probably would've done more damage sticking to Focus and just accepting your death, rather than actually bother to switch between for survivability.

    Bout that resistance video, can I have your word that the Turtle Hermit wasn't using Karma Buff, or anything of the sort?(If possible, maybe record another video? If you won't, I'll just take your word for it). I noticed that you were locked on yourself throughout the entire video, and the Turtle magically landed nearly every CC/Debuff; While Horrid was having trouble landing his CCs against Skedar(resisted 35-40%). Besides even if the video was 100% legitimate, I wouldn't consider stalling for time real counter play against Ulti. At some point the Ultimate WILL resist, and when they do, they'll eviscerate the Turtle Hermit. If you check the video below, you'll notice a huge dodge difference between his resist video, and the fight against Nemesis. Without any dodge buff he has approximately 860 dodge, but in the video he had only 904 WITH his dodge buff(Perhaps I'm wrong to assume that you maxed your dodge buff?).

    Here's a video of CodeNemesis vs Skedar: (I couldn't post the video, because it was censored, weird. Just check his most recent video) The problem with going full Focus, like I said multiple times is Ultimate's CC, they can very easily interrupt the Turtle's CCs. In addition to that there's the issue of survivability, despite wearing con Skedar managed to lower his health quite rapidly; If he were wearing Focus the entire time, he'd have gotten squashed np. Fun fact, guard level 3 increases resist dramatically. Even players like Horrid have problems dealing against those with maxed guard. In most scenarios, the Turtle Hermit is forced to start off with Con(otherwise they'll die), and because of that the chances of them sleeping the Ulti lowers drastically. After the 1st round of exchange, the Turtle will more than likely have had their auto-pot activate. Once that's occurred, it's just a matter of time before the Turtle screws something up(resist, mistake, dodge, etc) until the Ulti wins.

    Perhaps this is presumptuous of me to conclude. But if you still have objections, I'm willing to listen. Wouldn't it be logical to conclude that because Ultimate can't be killed by any class aside from Crane, and doesn't have any concrete counters justify it as being "broken" when scaled to top tier classes?

    Shadow Knight - Hard countered by Ultimate Majin, Dende, and Karma Majin.

    Dende - Hard countered by Karma Majin, Turtle Hermit, and Crane

    Karma Majin - Hard countered by Swordsmen

    Ultimate Majin - Hard countered by virtually nothing

    Now if I were to suggest changes that can be made to balance Ultimate Majin, it'd start with removing the self-removal effect that's on their paralysis/stun removal abilities. I don't see why the creators decided it was a good idea to even make Ultimate's CC removal ability applicable to themselves while they're CC'd, while the other classes don't have this effect. Aside from that, I'd pretty much leave Ultimate Majin alone. I think it's a fair change to make Ulti moderately less obnoxious without "killing" the class. Maybe even nerf their damage significantly, however I'd make their skill animations a lot faster to balance the nerf with a buff.

    Resistance vs Focus

    Allow me to first say this, my objective isn't to whine simply because I can't beat Ultimate Majins. Like I said before, I was once an Ultimate Majin when I used to play; My objective is to narrow down the factors that support my thesis to try to convince YOU and the community(they're just a bonus, though). And I don't care that you're the only Ultimate Majin to have won budokai, we're discussing these thought experiments under the assumption both parties have the best possible gear and are highly skilled. I saw your resist video, but I have a testimony from a Karma acquaintance who claims that you were able to resist approximately 40% of their CCs with your dex/confuse resist% set up. When it comes to resisting confusion, most players(or all the players that I've talked to actually) claim that confuse resist% renders confusion nearly useless.

    Shadow Knight: You can't switch 2+ pieces of armor constantly before you attack(especially if you're using CD), it takes a bit of time depending on your ping(You can't switch during an attack animation either). If we push aside the fact that SK CAN get killed by Ultimate Majin(very easily if they use full focus 100% of the time), there's also no way in hell a SK's going to deal 3+ health bars of damage vs a Ulti. Like I've said countless of times killing geared Ultimates isn't possible if you're not a Crane.

    Grand Chef: Perfectly timed senzu renders any last health/EP attacks virtually pointless. In theory, Grand could maybe pull a win like that against Ulti during 60 cap of Retail when it was OP, but not in the current stage of DBOG. Furthermore, that's under the assumption the Ulti just stands there and takes it. I think it'd be fair to assume that the Ulti would also charge their RP in order to use candy(with duration RP if needed), and KD to win last second.

    Dark Warrior: It's almost like you've missed the entire segment I made about confusion resist%, it works wayy differently than using full dex against the Turtle you fought. From my sources, it renders confusion virtually useless, and then there's paralysis removal. Their CCs are useless against Ulti. DW doesn't have a stun, they have para/confusion. Their only bleed has cast time, so by the time their attack hits, the Ulti would've removed the paralysis, and began to remove the bleed before using senzu.

    Poko/Dende Priest: I can imagine Poko's long range KD being quicker than Ultis, however Dendes don't have long ranged KDs. Even if they did, a timed senzu renders their attempts to lower your health useless.

    Turtle Hermit/Crane: Sure, I agree that they just have to keep their distance. But the problem with them going full focus is anti-candy, if they wear anti-candy it takes away a little from their Succ rate. Depending on how the Ulti starts the match, they can manage to land multiple hard hits on them, with the addition of having their combos interrupted with candy if they go full Focus. But most of the time the match will be decided by dice.

    You never replied to my question that I wanted answered concerning Ultimates counters: Does Ultimate have any concrete counters it generally CAN'T beat?


    Ultimate majin can generally put up a fight against ANY class, not necessarily have advantage during battle, but still put up a fight one way or another.

    But also that, is not exclusive to Ultimate Majins only.

    Before we argue about the classes who have the "advantage" over a Ulti who can fight them somewhat equally, would you agree that Ultimate Majin has no concrete counter; A class that generally beats Ultimate Majins in most situations.

    And just to reply to the "i am the bully" comment, you were pretty much being a bully. Didn't even bother to try to acknowledge what I had to say, or try to combat my arguments the first couple of times with anything aside from "call me sensei". But that's besides the point, we're passed that stage(hopefully).

    Dark Warrior: In terms of beating UM their CCs are rendered completely useless(confuse resist% + para removal), neither party can kill each other. Trying to win by dice is virtually the only thing they can do, maybe they can manage to save a couple of RP balls for the end of the match to KD + bleed(although a perfectly timed senzu counters that) to win by health. As for how the Ultimate Majin can beat DW, they've got burn/Candy(with Duration RP if they need to) with the addition of the same long range KD that DW have. Theoretically if the DW is perfectly geared, they could switch to burn def gear to diminish the ulti's burn and senzu bean. I would imagine in most cases both the Ulti and DW would be evenly matched(Dice decides winner) if both players are skilled.

    Plasma Majin: I don't know why you bothered placing this on the list, if DBOG's "top" Karmas such as Horrid can barely defeat you, I don't see why any Plasma in existence would stand a chance against Ultimate Majin. If the Plasma SOMEHOW manages to survive until the end(which I'd imagine in most scenarios they won't), then MAYBE they can win by dice. However in most cases the Ultimate Majin would have a large advantage over the Plasma. With confusion resist% they've rendered almost all of their CCs useless, KD spam without CCs is hardly a threat, and naturally killing the Ulti isn't even an option for the Plasma. Ulti has the advantage.

    Karma Majin: Karma is hardly a counter for Ultimate Majin, throughout the fight the Karma is forced to be on the defensive just so that they don't end up being killed by the UM. Karma has 2 tactics in order to beat a skilled UM, that's either to KD them out, or to win by dice; Killing the UM naturally isn't an option(Even if they wear dex). During the match the UM can wear dex because they don't need props to tank the Karma's damage, and they don't need to worry about confusion taking care of them as they won't die, that leaves Skill lock as their only viable tactic against them. While UM with full dex is capable of resisting 40%(approximately) of all CCs that a Full focus Karma dishes out, and if they resist their skill lock the Karma is forced into a position where the Ulti can damage them as much as they want for a little. Since the KM will be using Focus armor that lowers their health to the point where UM has the opportunity of killing them. So in terms of trying to win by dice/survive Ultimate's definitely got the advantage. When it comes to them trying to KD the UM, I would argue that the UM still has the advantage in that regard, solely due to resist though. Assuming that the Karma lands their slow, their KDs, and Skill lock in that theoretically perfect scenario the Karma can KD them out. However, that's if they manage to force the UM near the edge, and have their KDs/CCs/slow ready at the same time. It's not easy to pull off as the Karma is still trying to control the fight in a way that the UM doesn't get the chance to just obliterate them. Ulti definitely has the advantage against Karma Majin.

    Grand Chef: Ulti and Grand are pretty much equivalent when they fight each other. Neither can kill each other, nor can KD themselves outside the arena; Thus the match is decided by dice.

    Poko Priest: Although I'm not too well versed in Poko, I'd imagine most scenarios would end up being decided by dice. I don't see UM or Poko killing each other, and if it's a matter of keeping their health up, neither party struggles in that department. However, I will argue that Poko would have the slight disadvantage because of their EP. If the UM focus fire the Poko rather than wait for the timer to run out, theoritically they can force the Poko to keep healing until they run out of EP. However, I'm not 100% certain how that would be work over the span of 3 minutes, but I bet the UM can more than likely pull off a kill(although I reckon it's rare, and you'd have to go under the assumption they wouldn't just use pills as a substitute to manage their EP). I'd say they're just about equal.

    Dende Priest: Pretty much the same scenario as Poko, however UM wouldn't be able to kill the Dende under any circumstance(nor would they have EP issues). Battle of dice, they're just about even, however UM has long ranged KD and burn that they can use to screw with the Dende last second.

    Crane Hermit: Crane Hermit is essentially a downgraded version of Turtle Hermit against Ultimate Majin. They can try to KD the ulti out, but since they have to charge for their RP, 1 out of their 2 usable KDs runs on success rate rather than hit rate putting them at a disadvantage when compared to Turtle. They also can't spam their KDs continuously like Turtle can without sleeping their opponent after 3 KDs. When it comes to damaging the Ulti, I wouldn't necessarily say they have it worse than Turtle Hermit. Turtle Hermit already does trash damage against Ultimate Majins, but if you use burn defense right before your sleep ends(to force them to use Solid burn with power RP) you'll make it hard for them to land enough burns, because they also have to spend the majority of their RP balls on KD. However it isn't impossible to kill the Ultimate Majin either, you can even argue that they have it better than Turtle in regards to damaging the Ulti. However generally I'd imagine the Ulti can survive for over 3 minutes with the use Autopots/Senzu beans. Crane TECHNICALLY has the advantage, but they're not a concrete counter as it can be a struggle as a Crane to kill Ultimates.

    Turtle Hermit: Killing the UM isn't an option, and even if they magically manage to land 100% of their Slows/KDs/Sleeps tbey still have to worry about Ultimate Majins removing their debuffs in order to become mobile again. In theory if the Ulti wears move% boots, they can still tank the Turtle's attacks pretty efficiently on top of managing to prevent the Turtle from knocking them off the arena. In order to land all their CCs the Turtle Hermit has to go full Focus(rip their health), but if they don't give up their success rate neck/focus rings the Ulti can still candy them from afar. If it's still possible, maybe they can try to sleep lock the Ulti throughout the match in order to win via dice. But I'd imagine most cases where they go for KD, it'd only give the Ultimate an opening to land a solid cluster bomb that'd mess them up real bad(They also have less defense than Karma, as they're humans). But due to their high success rate of landing all their sleeps, lets say that they're equivalent to Ultimate Majin. Ulti has survivability, while Turtle Hermit has high success rate to keep them locked in place.

    Shadow Knight: Finally, the last class I have left to cover. Even if you use pretty much the best strat against Ulti which is to go full focus, and CD in order to spam Taunt debuffs and their other debuffs, generally the Ulti won't lose. Going Full Focus, and CD would only render you defenseless against the Ultimate's absurd damage as seen with Pram vs Skedar.

    The only way for SK to defeat Ultimate Majin(with good gear) in DBOG was to use the arm pull KD strat, which Daneos removed from the game. If it weren't for Sendoku abusing the Arm-KD strategy, Skedar would've squashed him with no problems at all. Ultimates are very tanky(virtually unkillable), they resist A LOT(as seen in the Sendoku fight, and from what I've heard about Karma vs Ultis), and without KD, SK can't do anything against Ulti aside from use lp% and hope that they don't need to use senzu until last second.

    Thus in conclusion, the only class in the entire game with any real form of advantage against Ulti is Crane Hermit. Dark Warrior, Turtle Hermit, Grand Chef, Poko, and Dende are capable of just about fighting "evenly" against Ulti. While Ulti is beatable by Karma, generally they have a concrete advantage over them in a fight, and Plasma Majins/MAs don't stand an inch of a chance.

    Just an extra note, but aside from Crane(whose attacks bypass phy/eng defense) that struggles heavily to kill Ulti, none of the other classes even come close to killing Ultimate Majin. Unkillable + no concrete counter; The only way to win is by dice or KDing them out if you can(Which you won't accomplish most of the time).

    Sigh, I started with the conversation with the intention to have a respectful and fruitful conversation. I've given my suggestions, and argued my points, yet all you've done is try to slander/straw-man me. Frankly, I find it both disgusting and funny. It really gets on my nerves that you're so darned arrogant that you can't even comprehend what I'm trying to say. You claim you can teach me how to beat Ultimate Majin, yet I haven't made a single post regarding Ultimate being impossible to beat. My WHOLE premise was that when scaling one class to another class in terms of how broken they are, Ultimate Majin would come out at #1. I don't believe Ultimate Majin is unbeatable, like I've said before I know multiple strategies certain classes could use to beat Ultimate Majin. But in most scenarios, Ultimate Majin would most likely have the advantage. Another thing I'd like to add is that you don't have to be unbeatable to receive a nerf: *cough Karma cough*

    Edit: Before a Mod removes my post, please don't. My intention isn't necessarily to start a flame war with Skedar, as it is to get my point across. This is entirely for the sake of continuing a pseudo-discussion.

    call me sensei and i might consider giving you some tips on how to battle the scary ultimate majins.

    Skedar, finally given up? You remind of those Danganronpa characters at the end when they can't prove their innocence, then they start spouting out rubbish. I think it's safe to say there's not much you can go off of to defend Ultimate Majins. Out of all the classes in the entire game, it's the only one WITHOUT a hard counter. Sure, it doesn't 1 shot SKs, nor does it regenerate 100k lp per heal. But Ulti doesn't need all that jazz in order for it to be the most broken class in the entire game.

    I don't need tips on how to battle Ultimate Majins, I've got a couple of strategies in mind; Besides I don't play DBOG anymore. I hang around Forum giving suggestions, and arguing/discussing said suggestions.

    Well it's not a bug, on the confusion resist% accessory there's an additional effect on the rings I believe(Ex: -16% petri duration, or something like that). I'm not saying that your strategy(SK one) isn't adequate, but it's definitely incomplete. If you don't combine taunts/grenade with life steal/curse your debuffs won't last long at all. On top of their ridiculous defense, you'll find them constantly healing back to full LP.

    The problem with SM vs Ultimate Majin is a variety of variables: Ping(server freezes), Ring out bug(Players go back inside the arena), their low damage(I believe plus 14 SM don't crit for more than 4k, which in turn is translated into less than 2k because of lp%), Ultimate's ridiculous damage, and the Ulti's stun removal. Killing the Ultimate Majin is hardly an option when you need to crit 6 to 9 times over without your opponent healing/using any health items. Even if you manage to bypass their resist/stun removal with Focus/CD, you'd have to sacrifice virtually all your health and defense just to keep them locked. Considering how obnoxious Cluster bomb is.... nuff said. Oh yeah, there's also the game freezing for a couple of seconds that trash CC/KD lock classes.

    If I were to come up with a nerf to one Ultimate skill, it'd be to make it so that Ulti can't remove stuns if they're stunned. I don't see why the tankiest class in the entire game needs that extra effect every other CC removal ability lacks. Now if I were to just nerf the class itself, I'd nerf their para/stun removal so that they can't use it on themselves when stunned, and I'd nerf their DPS significantly. And if possible, I'd create seperate ENG/Phy sets for Mighty/Wonder Majin. The Mighty Majin armor set would have to be nerfed for sure, with only 2 pieces of physical armor they can tank any MA in the entire game. But I wouldn't want to kill off Wonder Majin, hence why there are 2 start class sets for Majins.

    I don't need you to teach me anything, you don't get to make ridiculous claims without concrete evidence, or at the very least some form of an argument. I could very well go around claiming that Dende can one shot all the classes, but until I make up a scenario/argument for where/why that'd be possible, my argument is irrelevant. Which by the way, it's possible; If a level 70 plus 15 Dende fights naked level 30s. See what I did there?

    I never said that you stated: "Ulti is weak". I specifically said that you make giant claims to lowball Ultimate Majin as much as possible without falling off the edge of telling the truth.

    If you've got a legitimate argument for ANY class can counter Ultimate entirely, go ahead try me. There isn't a single class capable of completely countering Ultimate Majin, my evidence being those who do stand a chance against Ulti have to win via Dice. I won't bother restating my arguments, go read what I posted above, if you have any disagreements I'm more than happy to listen to them.

    You're a member of the balance team I'd expect you to do better than make empty arguments.

    If you spam nonsense or just say stuff like you dont know shit about this class without providing points to back up your claims then you will look very immature and I will not respond to such imbecilic responses.

    "Spam nonsense" me? Lmao, you mustn't have read all the other 1k word essays I've wrote on various threads concerning the pros/cons of certain classes.

    Karma Majin: As for Karma Majin, as Horrid said it's the Ultimate's advantage. The Ultimate could quite literally go full dex against a full focus/prop Karma, and they'd tank them the entire time; If Karma misses a single CC the Ultimate's given an opportunity to get a couple hits on the Karma. If the Karma somehow manages to land EVERY single CC, then they'll be forced to win via Dice. This wouldn't be the case if confuse resist% didn't damn near guarantee a confusion resist. And unfortunately that's not all, for some darned reason confuse resist% also decreases petrification duration.

    Swordsmen/Fighter: If the Ultimate Majin doesn't use autopot, senzu bean, or any of their LP items, then MAYBE a plus 15 SM can kill Skedar; But just like Fighter, they won't accomplish anything 9/10 times. The best strategy a Swordsmen can use against Ultimate Majin is full focus/CD, assuming they somehow manage to survive a Ultimate's barrage of attacks(which won't be often considering they'd be wearing Focus), they can attempt to continuously spam their stuns/KDs until the Ulti is knocked out. However KDing players out nowadays is really iffy, for some reason certain players can just jump back in the arena as they please after being knocked out. Killing a Ultimate Majin who's wearing an entire physical defense set even with full props is unrealistic with the game's current state. I've got a plus 14 SM acquintance who wasn't able to do anything against Skedar in terms of dealing a single health bar. I won't bother making a separate paragraph for Fighter, I'm sure just about anyone can agree that Thunder/Needles will NEVER come close to killing a Ultimate Majin. I'm not sure if you're aware of this, a plus 14 Fighter fought Skedar, and he won via heals and reflect(didn't even bother to attack the guy).

    Dark Warrior/Plasma Majin: Dark warriors can't exactly kill Ultimate Majins, and since the recent arm pull nerf they've been rendered useless against Ultimate Majin. They'd stand a chance if it was possible to land confusion, but as I stated previously that won't happen with confuse resist%. Same can be said about Plasma Majins, at best they can try to KD them out; However when all your CCs are rendered useless, and with KDing out being weird.... Enough said.

    Turtle Hermits: To be honest, there's not much I CAN say about Turtle Hermits; They're kind of an enigma for me in terms of fighting Ultimates. IN theory they should be able to put up a good fight against Ultimate Majins, however Skedar managed to 3-0 arguably the best Turtle in the entire game. In terms of killing the Ultimate Majin, that's obviously not an option. I know it's going to sound iffy when I say this, but I don't believe Turtle can kill Prop Ulti; and before you try to call me an idiot who's spouting nonsense, hear me out. If Karma Majin can't manage to kill a dex Ulti, despite them being able to damage the Ulti THROUGHOUT the match(Turtle can't damage Ulti while they're sleeping), I don't believe a Turtle can do anything against a Prop Ultimate Majin. It's really just a matter of Ultimate Majin waiting to resist/dodge to get an opening against the Ulti. It's the same scenario with Karma Majin, they have to win via Dice, and if they're not lucky the Ulti gets an opening to attack them.

    Shadow Knights: Listen, as an ex-Ultimate Majin your strategy will most certainly not work. Even if you're smart about your debuffs, the Ultimate Majin will be able to remove them almost instantly if they've have the slightest hint of "skill" in this game. They can just about counter any Bold Strike that comes from the SK via paralysis/bleed removal + heal. A better strategy would be to spam taunt debuffs with full focus and CD accessories, and THEN use curse/life steal; That way you're simultaneously nerfing their damage somewhat, and keeping them from removing your debuffs. However, although it's possible to kill a Ultimate Majin with plus 15 crafted armor with this strategy, it's very difficult to kill one using CC90 armor. And that's assuming the Ultimate Majin wearing CC90 armor doesn't use senzu/autopot. Dealing with 3 UM health bars, when Ulti has the most props, lp% in the entire game, and one of the highest amounts of defense; It's just not going to happen. It'd be a miracle if you managed to lower their health 1 or 2 bars in 2-3 minutes, but the 3rd just won't happen. A prop SK does hardly any damage, a CD/Focus SK won't accomplish much except for lose more health(SK loses health not Ulti), then there's their obnoxious resist. Best they can do is win via dice, if they're not dead by the end of the match. Life steal was essentially their breadwinner when it came to damaging, but that's been nerfed so they've got nothing to offer against Ulti. You can try to argue that with more DoT debuffs, thus they can win via health. However if they time their senzu perfectly, it's null and void.

    Crane Hermit: Well they can by multiple means, none of which are effective against a fully geared Ultimate Majin. One strategy is they can try to sleep lock the Ultimate Majin throughout the entire fight(If they manage to land all their hypnosis') to win by dice, another is they can try to by KD. Winning by KD against Ultimate Majin is very unlikely to occur, in addition to their resist, they can also remove debuffs making it very difficult to accomplish(If anyone's actually managed to accomplish that). If the Ultimate Majin wanted to, they could wear full anti bleed, and burn defense on their Eng set to nearly nullify the Crane's damage. Then the Crane Hermit is forced to spend RP balls on their burn in addition to the already costly KD spam. If they Crane Hermit tries to TS them, they can quickly switch to their Con set(if needed) in order to survive. Of course going with the defensive strat would make it "difficult" to kill the Crane, but I'd argue it's somewhat in the Ultimate Majins favor. The Ultimate Majin has the option of switching to anti-Crane damage gear in order to control the match so that they win by dice, but Cranes can do the same, so they're just about even in that regard. But if the Crane screws up one of their KDs, or CCs it allows the Ultimate Majin to land a possibly fatal blow on the full focus/CD Human. In terms of controlling the match it's a battle of mind games between Crane and Ulti, however Ultimate has the defensive advantage over Crane.

    When it comes to Grand/Poko, and Dende I pretty much agree with you. I've heard rumors that skilled Dendes like DrMed can kill SKs with ease, and possibly even Ultimate Majins; But those are just rumors, and naturally the Dende has to have better gear than the Ulti.

    Alright, for the sake of continuing a productive conversation on this thread, can you name one/several scenario(s) where Ultimate Majin wouldn't overpower the other person?(Ex: Ulti vs SK, DW, etc). And I mean this with utmost respect, my goal isn't to antagonize you. I truly wanna hear why YOU don't believe Ultimate Majin is very powerful, especially in comparison to other classes. Regardless if you know why/why not Ultimate Majin is/isn't overpowered, you've gotta explain your point so it can argued. We're not going to sit around and just assume that what you tell us is the complete truth; a majority of what you do say is heavily biased and skewed in a way to lowball Ultimate Majin(from what I've seen at the very least).

    yea sorry jimmy fought that sk when cd was nerfed already, sendoku not, and capping cd to 70 is considered as swordsman nerf. POB swordsman was OP way stronger than current except that crit dmg bonus swordsman received was the only buff they got

    I would argue that the CDR cap affected not only SM but also Karma Majins, Fighters, and arguably Turtle Hermit. The change at first didn't mean much to Karma because of their CD RP on skill lock but as of recent OB changes to the class.... you get the idea. If CDR cap was changed back to the original, I reckon Karma would be able to spam KD for the entire match if they had perfect ping(If they had perfect Ping). As for Fighters, they can't just spam Thunder like they used to back in Retail's 60 cap. Turtle Hermit was probably the least affected as they can still sleep lock you for the most part, but they were still relatively nerfed. You wouldn't be wrong in the sense that it did negatively affect SM, however I wouldn't necessarily say it was specifically a SM nerf.

    I wouldn't necessarily say SM was in it's prime during PoB either. Sure PoB SM in it's prime can be argued to be stronger than OB SM because they could skill lock a SK during the entire match. However the actual damage itself was trash, and it didn't do all that well against a lot of classes(However it hard-countered SK). But during the end of PoB, SM was essentially OB SM; but without the crit damage amp, and CD buff.

    Its time to test some classes who changed its not ob anymore and i dont drop random factors. I play swordsman and ik how it changed from pob swordsman and you obviously not

    I disagree, I've been keeping up with what's going on with the new changes that have been implemented into the game. Name one factor that you referenced in your post that holds any relevance to the Jimmy video I posted. CDR cap/Stun diminish completely irrelevant, Jimmy also faced these issues and prevailed victorious against the SK. I played SM during the entirety of PoB; by the end of PoB SM was severely weaker in comparison to it's OB counter part, SM has yet to receive a single nerf that wasn't present during the time I played SM.

    Edit: I've noticed you haven't bothered to reply to a single point that I made in my previous post. Let me just say that theoretically if I hadn't ever played Swordsmen, how would that invalidate ANY of my claims? So far everything I've claimed has either been recorded, or it's based off of experiences that certain players have had playing as/against SM.

    play swordsman and try doing it like jimmy or sendo you wont do it cuz cd cap is 70

    How do we go from nerfing stuns to CD being nerfed? DBOG's CDR has always been capped at 50% aka approximately 71 CD. Jimmy still managed to succeed in using his KD lock despite this "nerf". And no I won't play SM, I have no interest in leveling/gearing up another character unless I'm given access to the test realm. Fun fact, I was a SM during PoB if that means anything to you. I know what I'm talking about relatively well, you on the other hand are pulling out random irrelevant factors. So what if stun diminish/CD cap makes it hard for SM to KD lock SKs? Skilled SM, or rather the "above-mediocre" SMs are still capable of winning with relative ease against most SKs.