Posts by ethanvolcano21

  • My thoughts about combat adjustments PVE & PVP

    Quote from shinjii

    L2P

    I'm not saying that these classes are useless, only they they're outclassed. Sure they can achieve success and anyone skilled enough can make them worthwhile, however they would effectively be neutering themselves by doing so when other classes have so many more benefits and positives that forgoing that would be pointless.


    As a point of argument: A pro player can take a "B" class character, and win against "S" class characters against players who aren't skilled. However if two evenly skilled players match each-other, choosing a character from a lower tier would be to intentionally handicap yourself due to the nature of the character you're using. Games aren't ever truly balanced, but what we have here are characters that're outmatched in every regard. There's nothing class B can do that class S can't do better.


    There is NO reason to choose a Plasma Majin over a Karma or an Ultimate. There is NO reason to pick a DW over a SK (well.. I mean some arguments can be made, but overall they involve incredibly skilled players using the best of the best +15 gear to make valuable, so its overall outclassed)

  • MY thoughts on how to make this game a bit better (Upgrade + Boxes = Gear)

    Here we go again with another tirade about why everyone should quit their jobs, sell all their clothes/furnature, and live in a box inside your mothers basement for the duration of your life to play an obsolete MMORPG just because. Short answer- No.


    Long answer:

    Quote from DreameR68

    Before I start I would like to say that you shouldn't compare dbog to another game you like or love.

    First sentence- Don't compare DBOG to better games, because... er... reasons. The only reason I'd think of comparison is to illustrate how features in this game fail to achieve their goal, whereas in othergames this isn't the case. Minor adjustments could easily be implemented to correct these glaring flaws. Asking us to disregard these horrible mistakes is just an open admission at how terrible this game is. Your solutions are to make things worse, thereby highlighting the few good features. Words alone cannot express how stupid and toxic a mentality like that is. That you should have to think "Hmm... lets make this game WORSE to make it better" is beyond comprehension. Furthermore, I do not hate you, or anyone, for arguing an opinion I disagree with. Afterall, what would be the point of conversation if we hate each other?


    I disagree with you, I do not hate you.

    Yes, that's how games work. You work to get a particular piece of gear and armor to equip your character with, which allows you to farm more difficult opponents, etc. Rinse and repeat. Are you seriously trying to argue in favor of a system which outright deletes your progress for NO OTHER REASON other than to limit your progression due to the incomplete nature of this game? That defies all logic. No game developer, no programmer, and certainly no serious player would argue in favor of a system that can delete progress, just to make sure that the limited content, which is already not worth working for, all the more difficult to get. The goal of game design is to reward players for their progress, not punish them for making "too much" progress. It defies all game design logic!

    As if Having to grind for 6 hours a day just to get a few dozen stones which aren't even capable of brining you up to par with most end-game related content isn't already difficult enough, you're actually arguing that the grind should be made more tedious, less rewarding, because it makes you feel good about your progress. That's not an argument, that's just penalizing the entire player base for wanting to enjoy this broken game, and you feeling left out because you feel there isn't already enough of a huge gap between new players and old. Newsflash- Of all the new players that join, few ever even make it to the level cap, and the ones that do quit the game almost immediately once they see that the only thing left for them is an 100 hour mindless grind to get gear that isn't even rewarding.


    You even admit that only the rich could afford end-game content. All this does is WIDEN that divide between cashers and non-cashers, not lessen it!


    Your solution: Make it HARDER. Do you have a job? Quit it! Relationships? Who cares! Responsibilities? Children even? Pfft, abandon them, and play DBO. Forever.





    Quote from DreameR68

    5. Make everything tradeable

    Every item should be tradeable. Some people don't want to farm but then at least the guys that do the farming should be rewarded by the players that want to cash their items. This way the "farmer" and the "casher" would be happy.

    That's... Actually not a bad Idea. An Open economy would allow for the easier distribution of otherwise unobtainable items. It allows for players with not as much time to play alternative methods to achieve the particular items they want. If you dont have time to farm Gold Coins, this allows for the purchase and sale of them. The sealing system effectively prevents players from obtaining the gear they want by locking it behind rng, however this system would allow for the better distribution of items and allow for more economic opportunities. This would have major implications for the in-game market, and is actually a very good Idea.

    Quote from DreameR68

    6. Remove crafting

    Crafting is way to fast and easy. You get nearly the best gear for doing literally nothing. You get much more craft items back if you break the crafted items than you used for them. Back on tw crafting was released much later with lvl 70 cap where it didn't really matter but back then it was much harder and more expensive and more time consuming to craft. I would say just remove crafting

    And here it is- the nail in the coffin if most (but not all) of your arguments. That you should have to REMOVE features to make a game better is the pinnacle of bad game design. It's one thing to make worse the features that are already implemented, but to outright remove features that players unanimously use and enjoy is just ridiculous- NOBODY would vouch for such a decision. They might argue how the system could be changed and reimagined, but to remove a system so inherently tied to the metagame and in-game economy is beyond all reason.


    tl;dr:


    Removing features does not enhance a game.


    Increasing an already insane grind to something effectively impossible to maintain without giving up your life/responsibilities is not good game design.


    Ensuring that cashers are given all the advantages in the world does not, in any capacity, contribute to the longevity of this game.

  • My thoughts about combat adjustments PVE & PVP

    Quote from Azwar

    You would also have to consider games like dragons nest in terms of role play all classes can effectively fill roles as well as perform in solo missions and most games have been steering away from one class being useless when it comes to soloing pve dungeons and pvp in general, final fantasy xiv added in sync and non sync as an example. Plus commanding missions where you lead your own team that you've hired. Black desert online gives you chances to play how you want even if classes are involved. Trove steered into a new direction as in constantly upgrading gear to have higher power ranking whilst using potions as a way of keeping them alive longer. Gaia online's MMO, zOMG has class system but every stat is technically the same for each player. If DBZ continues its own route at least it could find a way to use TERA as a guideline. Maybe Skyforge as well where there is a huge stat tree to boost your own stats similar to path of exile. But that's just a few examples whether they want to continue their way or not they have to make the decision as soon as they can and not stay dormant with the game. Because right now we're living in a time where MMO's are shutting down quite rapidly after launching big and final updates, due to first person shooter games being a thing.

    You make good points, I'm a Elder Scrolls Online player myself, and its true that any class can fulfill any role, but some classes still outperform others allowing for min/maxing, which is something DBO centralizes on. You need to be geared/spec'd to do whatever, but theoretically any class could do any role provided one's skillful enough, but the game was made with that in mind. DBO is more of a classic mmo with defined roles. A dende's skills can never allow it to be a DPS, and a fighter will never be able to heal, whereas in ESO most skills are available to all races/classes (albeit some garner more special effects more than others)


    So we should first focus on making all classes USABLE before balancing them all. at this point, there's no reason to choose a plasma, or a Swordsman, as their roles are better fulfilled by Karmas/Fighters. We need to give these classes a reason to exist

  • My thoughts about combat adjustments PVE & PVP

    Quote from Azwar

    Solutions to these few problems would be to:

    1. Re-adjust the stats for all classes are in need and to be able to have it so that no "one class" should be a meta, many games fail to recognize this issue and have died far too fast because of it.

    -Remove the dodge stat entirely and replace it with a real-time dodge and evading system through the dash mechanism instead.

    -Re-adjust the Con+ formula Def+formula Dex+ formula so that they pan out evenly among all classes in base stats and reconfigure gear stats to give less con dex and def bonuses for end game (because these are the most important stats and mostly talked about regarding balancing issues).

    One thing that should be noted is that while the programmers have alot of influence over the game's design, they can't build/develop new systems from scratch. Well... its theoretically possible, but given the time it would take for new balanced metagame to be developed, and how players would just leave frustrated given that all of their gear has become obsolete, such a system wouldn't be feasible. Its best to work with what we have.


    So your solution ti make all classes balanced, while a good one, isn't possible with a game this old. This game was designed with specific class roles in mind, and we should keep that niche. Classes should be balanced insofar that one should never dominate, and one should never be useless. But you should never expect a dende to perform as affectively as a DPS. A game Shouldn't reward a team of 5 dendes easy outdoing a TMQ, when 5 swordsman cannot. Something isn't right there.


    There is also a PVP divide in this game: 1v1 or Pary Pvp, each with differing classes. And while this structure works in principle, what happens is that classes get thrown out, and skill is abandoned in place of gear/shilling/rng armor bullshit.


    The stats system is fine, its how the classes RECEIVE their bonuses which could make the difference.

    Quote from Azwar

    3. In most MMO's the most noticeable aspects to making them fun are usually the end game content and the PVP, Primarily PVP. But I will explain what I mean by classes aren't up to standard.

    -All characters should have the same amount or access to survival regardless of its class differentiate.

    -All classes have something unique to offer when playing a role and no class was less used considering whether its in skill or a play style.

    What you don't seem to realize is that these two foundations, while sound, are mutually exclusive. You cannot have both in a truly balanced game. In order to achieve balance, while this might seem counter-intuitive, classes must inevitably have specific niches and roles. Balance is achieved when the amount of roles of one character must be aided or countered by the existence of another character.


    For instance, a DPS role should be to do as much damage as possible, it just wouldn't make sense to allow for such a role to also serve as a tank/healer/DPS, it'd be unstoppable.


    In a balanced game, a DPS would be reliant on a tank to soak up damage, and this tank would be reliant on a healer to support/buff him, and this healer would rely on the DPS to protect him. We have a thematic chain where one role is dependent on and needs another, and no role on their own should be able to achieve success without the other.


    In a PVP sense, a tank should not be able to outperform a DPS in terms of raw damage, however the tank should not be necessarily able to lose 100% of the time. Classes should be given a fighting chance. My solution is to focus on Party PVP, as that has more variables, and thus requires more skill to outperform your opponent.


    Good post btw

  • Why people think TW was better than DBOG

    Quote from DreameR68

    We don't have much content in this game but we still want to play it. It doesn't make sense to try to increase the content because that won't happen soon or will never happen.

    And this is why the game's fate is sealed. DBO was developed with pay to win hurdles in mind. both the design of the game and the amount of content available were specifically tailored to require grinding in mind to lengthen the time it takes to make any visible progress. That's what KRMMO's are made for: incessant grinding is required to make any progress thereby encouraging you to have to pay real life currency to have any fun.


    The fact that we can't alter the content just lends itself to a second demise. DBO failed for the same reason, what we're seeing here is history repeating itself.

  • Why people think TW was better than DBOG

    Quote from Sirab

    ethanvolcano21 You chose the easy way out and replied to a more simplified version of my posts

    Without basing your accusations off anything you look awful. I took one of the points of your argument and countered that, without even bothering to address anything else because it wasn't important to what I was saying. My only goal was to illustrate how what you said, was wrong. And nothing more. I don't care about anything else you say because I don't wanna waste my time. The only reason I bothered responding to what I did was because it was so egregiously stupid.

    Quote from Sirab

    Your whole argument is “DBO should be like elder scrolls online”

    Not at all. Where the hell did say that? I'm only comparing the success of one mmorpg to the failures of another. There's a reason I play ESO some days, and DBO others. Did you know that you're ALLOWED to criticize things you like? That the only reason I waste my time on these forums is because I believe there's a slim chance that the game can be improved upon? You don't have to dislike other games just because you like another better.

  • Why people think TW was better than DBOG

    Quote from Takaroku

    This is possibly the most braindead, easy, no effort grinding you can ever find in a game.

    and yet Its one of the greatest mmorpgs out there, with people who've been playing it since its release in 2014, and I still find brand new experiences. I have hundreds of hours invested in it, and players with thousands still have reasons to play. You can argue that its "no effort", but fact of the matter is that players who play ESO are actually having fun and being rewarded for their efforts. Because the game designers recognize that fun gameplay isn't about acquiring loot, its about using it. Getting end-game armor is only half the battle, recognizing the best builds for each dungeon, class, pvp scenario is what's necessary, constantly improving the quality of your gear even after you obtain a decent set. Skill is rewarded more than anything: A crappy player with the best armor will never beat a good player, and you don't have to grind for literally hundreds of hours to get good loot.


    At the end of the day, we have two gaming experiences: One that's fun to play and offers thousands of gameplay hours and endgame content in the form of 25+ dungeons, 6+ raids, 10+ full sized continents to explore all with their own interesting and unique quests and environments, hundreds of armor sets to collect, dozens of combinations of classes to play all with their own niches, none of them are useless, and one gaming experience which is just dead.


    You can argue against me, but you can't argue away the success of ESO and the death of DBO

  • Why people think TW was better than DBOG

    Quote from Sirab

    Name a MMORPG that handed you almost everything just from afking.

    Do you even know how to read? Where did I say that afking should grant rewatds? I said the EXACT OPpOSITE! something you would know if you could read beyond a 2nd grade level.

    Quote from Bad Picollo

    Calling me toxic and troll what a awesome arguments, plz staph.

    Name where I called you toxic, seriously its like you guys are just imagining what your opponents say without ever bothering to read.


    Yeah ya know what? This community is shit, I'm out

  • Boxes to cash shop

    Quote from Iceman

    You need to have something in cash shop that will even help cashers and free players.

    Do you even realize what you're saying? Do you see the contradiction in your own words?! You need something in the CASH SHOP, ie: The place where you must pay real life money to enjoy an otherwise shitty gaming experience, that is accessible to free players.


    You've basically admitted two things:


    The game requires money to have fun, thereby admitting that grinding for hundreds of hours is poor game design


    and


    Cashers dominate the end-game precisely because this is pay to win. The fact that money grants an objectively better chance for end-game loot is proof enough. In this game you can pay to receive more exp, pay to travel in vehicles, pay to level up pets that allow for better transportation, etc. etc. The fact that you can pay money to achieve all of these gameplay advantages alone makes this a definitive P2W experience.

  • Why people think TW was better than DBOG

    Quote from Sirab

    Here’s a more simple way to put it for those who don’t want to read the OP.


    Player in 2011 DBO: “I still want to get my favorite dogi, want to +10 my sword maybe one day +12 it, and still want to get e def armors. This will be an adventure. Still a lot of gameplay left.”

    If you consider mindnumbing grinding sessions lasting for literal hundreds of hours "gameplay", then you ought to be easily entertained by paint drying for all the difference it makes. In the time it takes to level one character to cap, I could easily make several alts for Elder Scrolls Online, level them to 50, equip them all with decent end-game gear, and STILL have 50 hours of pvp/dungeon finding/gear searching to do. Even after that I'd have hundreds of hours to level up my crafting, constantly make gold to buy and upgrade recurring armor upgrades, etc.


    The fact that you have to admit that this game would struggle and die unless you spend your entire life in your basement is proof that this game offers no reasons to play it.


    Time and again, we have players object to criticism by literally arguing that demanding cash to have fun or wasting hundreds of hours of your life doing nothing but grinding is good game design. Obviously these players don't speak for the majority, which is scary considering they seem to be the vocal minority. Ie: Everyone's gone, this game is dead.

  • Why people think TW was better than DBOG

    Quote from Bad Picollo

    i said that in first day when i joined this game and i notice that broken option is gone: GIVE BACK BROKEN OPTION ppl start insulting me etc.

    Nobody insults you, you confuse criticism with personal attacks, and opposition as antagonism- Just because people argue against you, you feel the need to claim that they're "insulting you". If recognizing bad game design is insulting, than this game's been thoroughly roasted beyond the point of redemption. The game, in its current and near final state, deserves to be villified to the fullest, ensuring that a genuinely decent experience can come out of it.


    As it is, the forum exists as a warground of the dying- People are leaving by the day, the moderation team refuses to communicate with its community, the future looks dark right now. Eventually cashers will flock, and once the population drops below a certain threshold, the games future will be sealed.


    The only reason people argue against you is because they don't want the game to die!!! We're on the same side ya know! But as it is, even if any of the solutions anyone provides are half-decent, unless the moderation team considers them, we're basically wasting our breath. The death of this game will be due to an indifferent mod team, above all else.

  • Why people think TW was better than DBOG

    Rename the thread: What a DBO Fanboys need to have fun in their basements for the rest of their lives:


    You realize some of us have work and school, right? And we STILL have threads about "the good ol days" where the stupidly absurd grind was even shittier .


    Stop highlighting poor game design, and pretend as though it were functional.


    Stop Praising bad game design which demanded 100's of hours of grinding in a never-ending hell, and treat it as "fun gameplay", meanwhile exemplifying the fact that cash was basically required to have fun.


    Stop pretending as though people have nothing better to do than play DBO in their basements all day.


    Quote from Sirab

    In TW, you were happy to have full +6 armors and +8 weapons, why? Because there's still a ton of growth from there, and that's the whole point of a RPG.


    There are other MMORPG's out there which actually DO reward constant growth, without having a broken end-game. For instance in Elder Scrolls Online, A player whose played for 24 hours can be on the same playing field as someone whose played for 2400 hours, because skill is emphasized more than sheer grinding. All necessary end-game armor/weapons can be obtained in a relatively short time frame, and yet do you ever wonder why its still one of the largest MMO's out there? Because the mere POSSESSION of end-game loot doesn't become synonymous with being done with the game.


    The metagame is kept alive- All classes can play any role, and min/maxing can still be done in a fair and balanced way. You don't need to grind 100's of hours to get randomized loot, but instead can guarantee end-game gear that is 90% efficient to the best gear in the game.


    Strategy and hardwork maximizing your pvp DPS is rewarded more than just buying stones and praying for +15. In Elder scrolls online, upgrading armor isn't the hassle, it's putting that armor to good use to fulfill a satisfying niche.


    If your idea of a good game is literally grinding for stones all day, then GTFO because you're the reason DBO is toxic. If your only solution to improving a game is intentionally implementing horrible features meant to waste time, and extend the current mindnumbing grind, Then you are literally the problem

  • How DBOG can become a better game

    Quote from Haly

    Well, let's be serious.... I think the main flaw of this game is that it is too EASY to play. People complain about +15 and drop rate (etc) being hard. The thing they don't complain about is the fact that you can hit max level in less than 3 days...

    You can't be serious. Are you seriously suggesting that the GRIND is the highlight of the game? Contemporary entries into the MMORPG experience intentionally REDUCE the grind precisely because there's an endgame that doesn't suck, one that invites its players to enjoy the true game. No one can seriously argue that the fun in MMOs comes from grinding- the grind is meant to introduce players to the games mechanics and gameplay systems, and the endgame serves as a graduation and entry into the "true" experience.


    The grind ISNT SUPPOSED to be difficult, nor is it supposed to be overexpansive, because nowadays most mmos actually WANT its playerbase to reach the cap and actually enjoy the content the game has to offer. The main flaw in DBOG is that there is no endgame. The game is from 2010, and lacks any enticing features to keep its playerbase interested in it. The reason DBO died was because it couldn't keep its audience. If you're seriously arguing that altering the grind to cap is the problem, then you're one of the main causes of this game's lack of longevity.


    Its bad enough that people have to spend literal days grinding just to start having fun, when we have mmo junkies who have nothing better to do but stay in their basement and play DBO all day trying to argue that the grind should intentionally be made WORSE.


    GTFO

  • Wipe or Not?

    Why can't GM's be more active in the community in ways that don't include supervision? Why not host giveaaway events? Incentivize gameplay for non-cashers, and allow for people who don't get to play as often to at least have a chance to participate in end game content. Most complain how modern MMORPGS make the leveling grind too easy, but the reason that is has to do with how modern games are designed: Nowadays games offer so much breadth and depth of content that the game isn't about the grind like it was in the old days- The grind is more of a formality, most game devs want their players to experience the end game content.


    DBOG comes from an age where content was limited, so the grind was overinflated to compensate for a lack of any real substance. The end game needs to be made more accessible. PVP should be emphasized as the end-game, and PVE challenges should be implemented later on. Trying to sell a game that demands grinding with little/no payoff is silly in this modern era of MMO's. The grind isn't important, the end game is. What good is a game where only 1% of players and 100% of cashers get the endgame? A dead one.

  • Wipe or Not?

    A server wipe doesn't fix anything, it only delays the problems at bay. Erasing the status-quo doesn't erase the foundations of the server which led to the current state of affairs- It only ignores those very same problems and allows for history to repeat itself. What we should focus on are Actual Solutions to these PROBLEMS Instead of just B-lining it towards the self-destruct button.


    Anyone who advocates for a character wipe neglects to consider that most of us have school/work/lives. Not everyone can live in their basement and play DBOG all day.