Well said Sabin. Well said. Also with my idea for Silver Boxes letting you choose 2 effects make it to where you get to pick one effect and its value, but make this item an event exclusive item so you can't get many.
Posts by BlazingBarrager
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i played korean servers for god knows how long, that other guy sounds like all he did is read malu's comments in dbocom
Ah. Well sorry for being "that guy."
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Just out of curiosity does anyone in this discussion take into consideration how the RNG system is with drops and such? I mean Boxes are fine (or at least Silver Boxes, Brown Boxes were just terrible) and should stay. Why? Because it doesn't matter how much you increase the chances of, say, a legendary item dropping. You still have to deal with getting the right weapon and regardless of the chance rate the RNG system will still be against you. The sheer amount of drops in the game makes the odds against you high and you also need to remember that each mob gives a random number of drops.
So people saying making the upgrade system too easy by taking away the break function you really need to look at the big picture. RNG is a major pain in any game it's incorporated in, especially MMOs. This also isn't like the old Pokemon games where you can abuse the RNG system to your advantage. After all, you have to factor in:
The drop rate for weapons, armor, AND the upgrade stones (made worse with all the different kinds of weapons and gear, their effects, and their rarity; upgrade stones (and downgrade stones for that matter) not only have which stone drops, but also what level that stone is).
The random selection of whether you hit succeed, fail, or break. Even if we remove the item breaking it's still going to be a hassle getting to high upgrade levels and white stones aren't going to help you much.So as you see, DBO had one of the worst RNG systems ever (Xenoverse pales in comparison) by default. Saying that making the upgrade system easier will break the game is an overstatement. No matter how easy the devs make things with drops and the upgrade system the RNG system is still going to be against you. It could take minutes to get the desired weapon, or it could take hours. Hell it can even take days!
Anyway, this is my personal take on how the upgrade system can be improved to be more tolerable (it's never going to be easy unless they made it to where your only choice is success).
*Rework the Break to simply downgrade your weapon by a random amount (-3 or worse) while making fail degrade by a small amount (0 to -2)*
This may look less punishing, but as I said the RNG system will be doing its best to make your life hell. Even if the Break and Fail cards didn't impact you much you still wasted an upgrade stone and a white stone if used, and if you run out of stones you have to go back and farm for more while the RNG system laughs in your face.*Rework the level where Fail and Break cards appear*
Having weapons get to +6 before this happens while having armor get to +3 is just stupid. In my opinion, they should share the same value like +5 before having to go through the luck system of picking a card. Regardless of the amount, once you reach those three selections the RNG system will start making its move.*Keep the boxes, but buff them*
What I mean by this is allow Brown Boxes to let you choose 1 Attribute and Silver Boxes to let you choose 2. This may seem like a game breaker, but again it isn't. For starters, both boxes will most likely be hard to get in-game (Silver Boxes could even be made event exclusive). Even if you get your hands on some you still have to deal with the RNG system. After all, you only get to pick one attribute. That's it. The other attributes (as well as the selected attribute's number) are still left to chance so you could end up using all your boxes and still not get what you want.So yeah, try to consider everything in the equation before saying how altering something will make the game too easy.
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no it wasnt, korean servers had a considerable less amount of players thats the only reason "good items" were cheaper than other servers and even so a good weapon would cost at least 40 millions
Don't mean to be that guy, but do you know this through experience or proof?
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Is it alright to also talk about Dogi upgrading here? I know it doesn't use the same system, but it follows the same concept.
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Ah alright. I wasn't aware of how healthy KR economy was. Well as long as we can avoid zeni buyers for this game than I guess we can disregard this suggestion.
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Thanks. Another reason I made this is that another MMO I played, Digimon Masters Online, had it to where farming for currency/items was good enough that you didn't have to rely 3rd party sites. With enough time, you could make a good profit from selling drops and such. I feel DBOG should follow a similar theme.
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even if you try to use the tickets they wont work, tickets arent a thing anymore.
Which is a damn good thing because tickets were broken as hell.
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One of the things that absolutely sucked in old DBO was how tedious making a profit was. It's bad enough when getting good gear is a hassle, but not being able to get your worth in zeni from drops when farming sucked even more. It also prompted people to use 3rd party sites to buy zeni so they can get their gear easily, which added to the whole "pay2win" situation. Since DBOG is trying to avoid that, one suggestion would be to increase the amount of zeni you get from a drop. Now I'm not saying make it to where you could get a million zeni from one drop, but make it an amount that would allow you to make a good enough profit so that buying from the AH (or just supplies in general) wouldn't be a pain. It also helps with having people not rely on 3rd party sites for zeni.
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theres prolly gonna be a level cap becuase content.
This. Also going to 40 would put us in the middle of the RP2 dungeon when it comes to quests so it wouldn't be a good idea. As I said, I believe 38 is a good starting cap. It also makes it easier to start more than one character so that when the level cap rises with an update you don't have to use too much time leveling more characters when you got a head start.
BTW, love the sig and avatar Kiera.
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Double, maybe even tripled the stat effect of whatever transformation potion. gave you epic ki regen and didnt drain.
If the skill would be compared to ssj1 then this potion would be ssj2 and then some....but if i could put it into my own words" OP cash item that makes you GODLY for 30 mins or untill death."
Hence why it should be an item that shouldn't be easy to get and rely on over the transformation skill.
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I disagree because it modifies the original balance of the game.
You do realize that the entire game is getting rebalanced anyway right? Modifying transformations wouldn't be as drastic as some of the other things that will get reworked for balance.
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No. There's a reason why you reach the final steps to gain flight in the game. By that point you would have just achieved your Master Class and are prepared to tackle the challenging tasks that you're assigned. Not only that, but if the devs decide to keep the event item you get every so many levels than you'll get flight scrolls that will allow you to get to where you need to go. There's no reason to reduce the level to earn flight, especially to a low level like 5.
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To add to my "no" above, the primary reason for believing they shouldn't be breakable is the RNG system, and I'm not just talking about the upgrade system. You're literally going to have to farm/spam UDs and TMQs for your gear as well as upgrade stones in the first place, and the RNG system isn't very kind to us about that either. Let's say you managed to get the desirable pair of boots after five days of farming. You go to upgrade them and you get to +7 before your item breaks. You basically wasted five days of farming for those boots and however many days it took to get the upgrade stones in less than five minutes. I'm pretty sure no one wants to go through that a second time.
Buying gear in AH is going to be a hassle as well because collecting zeni is a chore in itself and allowing players to buy it off 3rd party websites defeats the entire purpose of the game not being p2w. People seem to think that getting gear, upgrade stones, etc. will be easy enough to warrant keeping this function. If the devs are going to keep the RNG system the same, than it sure as hell won't be easy. It will be frustrating and time consuming to the point where you just flat out don't want to do it.
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You know it's the whole "Saiyan" heritage argument that annoys me greatly. Yes it affects how easy it is to gain the form. It does NOT however determine how powerful the form is. The three transformations are skills like every other technique in the series. You train yourself to use the skill more effectively, which also raises its power. Kaio-Ken follows the same concept in fact with its SP. Hell there's a reason why they're called "Skill Points" in the first place. Keeping the transformations without SP goes against the entire concept of training (leveling and distributing SP) to begin with so we might as well not have them in the first place.
Also, relying on pots is just stupid. They were a Cash Shop item that you had to pay for so they're technically p2w items. Now of course this means they'll be put into the game somehow (a reward or event item or something). However, that does NOT mean they'll be easy to get. They need to be rare enough that people can't have a load of them at one time.
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No.
Personal reasoning: Destroying the item makes it too risky = too RNG based = leading to p2w. Since we don't want the game to go down that path, and since certain mmorpg's also started avoiding that, it's time we get with the program, too. Plus, it won't make things "easy", it just won't make them ridiculous.
The concluding idea we got to from the discussion thread was fine, I guess (break card = upgrade level back to 0, but still keeping the item). Though personally, I wouldn't make it instantly zero, and I would make upgrade stones harder to get instead. Such as them dropping only or mostly in dungeons, which makes people keep farming them after already getting the gear they want + farming more gear to sell to others in the process.
As for rates, you could make them a bit harder to balance it out, I suppose.
This has to be the best description for an answer in this thread. I also second this. I remember in old DBO I could never get past +9 as my limit before item breaks without tickets. I don't want the same experience here.
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Personally If i could spend 1 or 2 SP is SSJ to make it better then i would do it. I Think Kaioken is much more Reliable than ssj at the moment and i HATE that. Kaioken Mastered with 3 SP... is better than ssj. Makes no sense vs the show but thats just me.
Agreed, and they pulled the same crap in Xenoverse. Kaio-Ken x20 in XV gives you a 15% attack boost and unlimited use of Stamina skills (including an Ultimate). SSJ2 in XV only gives you a 5% increase in certain attack stats, drains your ki like it's a buffet, and is much easier to counter.
But seriously having Kaio-Ken be initially better than SSJ (and possibly Pure Majin for that matter) is just wrong. Now if it mattered if we buffed our Kaio-Ken to like x40 or something than yeah that would make sense, but a regular Kaio-Ken?
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Yeah, but it's still the player's choice if he/she wants to sacrifice points to spend on the transformation (or whatever they want to spend them on). It's what builds are all about, enabling everyone to be different and play their character the way they want to. Maybe to some people, using those points there might "change a lot" in a good way.
Given the fact that the classes will be balanced out in the end (maybe some skills might even take less points to max out in the future, who knows), you can rest assured that it would stay that way, if this idea does get implemented.
This. Even if you don't want to spend SP you can still have the transformation from the wish. Some people run Kaio-Ken at only 1 SP actually.
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I have a question for the devs if they can answer this: how hard would it be to implement this into the game?
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By adding something else the classes that use it need. Like cranes need increased dot damage and nothing will give them that , and turtles could use some skill cooldown reduction ( not transformation reduction, but skill cooldown reduction).Well Turtles are already going to have CD gear for Giant Kame and such so that helps. Don't know how SSJ can help with increasing a Crane's DOT damage, though it does help with their EP usage since a lot of Crane skills eat up a lot of EP.
Anyway, here's some things SSJ helps with for all the classes that makes it viable to Kaio-Ken (though not better than it).
Fighters: In addition to the increase dodge, they also get more hit rate which tremendously helps considering they have terrible hitrate to begin with. Since their High Speed Needles are most likely getting nerfed to their lv. 60 patch or something crits won't be as important, though they still help.
Swordsman: Honestly it's an either or for this class. While they would love the increased crit Kaio-Ken offers, the attack boost from SSJ (being the same as Kaio-Ken at equal SP) will still be helpful and the extra hitrate and dodge will be a nice plus.
Turtle Hermit: Again it's more of an either or. Kaio-Ken would probably be better in the long run, but SSJ is still useful thanks to the increased hitrate and dodge. It's also slightly bulkier since it has no LP drain like Kaio-Ken.
Crane Hermit: I'm not entirely sure with this class. I mean if their DOT damage increases with crits than Kaio-Ken would be a better choice. However, the double EP boost SSJ grants is still helps a bit.But yeah I will most likely run both on my Turtle Hermit, though I'd be using SSJ more. CD wouldn't be much of an issue anyway since CD reduction gear is basically a must for Turtles anyway.
