Posts by EchoSon

Quote from Muh

Also give a little buff on Hitrate in "Scent Marking" like 315 instead of 214 and boost "Spiritual Fountain Fragrance" values would have been better than buffing "Rising Streng" - i mean it needed a buff too, but with DEX it is to much.

"Spiritual Fountain Fragrance" would have been a buff for all party members not just Grand-Ma himself.

The reason he boosted every passive while leaving the actual buffs alone is because he really wants people to main buffers instead of playing the class they find more fun.(If you leveled a buffer and ended up enjoyed playing them more than other classes, you could simply switch to them as your main )

That much should be obvious by the type of updates aimed at buffers lately.

Quote from IMikaI

Wow, i just hope they do something for plasmas soon!

They are definitely next. They're too crap at PvE and solo PvP to be kept the way they are. I'm hoping after that we'll see a huge buff/change of playstyle in Pokos that focuses on their pets or even healing powers rather than making them a tank or DPS. Giving them a way to restore EP would be a huge deal. Hell, it may just be a good thing for a Plasma's Electrical Discharge too.

Instead of rationally buffing Chefs bit by bit, you're just going to throw some massive buffs into the wind and pray it'll work out? 30 to 60 STR, sure, but how can you just throw in a titanic 60 DEX as "bonus" like it's no biggie? Chefs can win entire tournaments through pure luck with that much DEX. Hell, even Fighters would kill to replace their Mastery passive with Rising Strength, and they're the ultimate "pray to RNGesus" class.

And I don't think you even realised what you've done when you made Defense Breath an AoE. Its cooldown should've been lowered to 1 second like Defense Breeze. I'm convinced the CD being 01:00 earlier was simply a developer mistake. But by making it AoE, you've given Chefs a humongous Party PvP buff, especially if you count in the 60 DEX.

Whoever suggested this was so eager to buff poor Chefs they forgot to actually think about what their suggestion entailed. Buffing low-tiers is noble, but if you have no clue what you're doing, then take things step by step.

Some people are pissed about this, others assume it's no biggie since tickets are "temporary", or think it'll be more fair to non-cashers somehow. Allow me to explain why this is TERRIBLE for the game if they're removed not just from the event-shop, but from the inventory as well.(and refund 250 honey blocks or an 500k LP autopot or something since that's only fair)

It's not fair for all players.

• This whole thing is completely unfair to anyone who missed the initial Honey Bee sprint or happened to be on vacation this week. They'll miss out on the game's peak power simply because they were asleep. Most people never get to taste the immense power of +15, and they'll kick themselves for missing the big moment where prices were still low and they could've farmed some honey for +15 tickets themselves.

2 weeks is enough to beat the entire end-game a million times over with full +15.

• You can get anything you want in 2 weeks. Sure, tickets won't work on RARE craft armor, but +15 excellent craft armor is plenty for any non-idiot to annihilate the biggest PvE challenge, CC150, especially with attack speed parties. +15 gives a huge proportional boost even over "high" upgrades like +12. So every dungeon in the game will be defeated, allowing every accessory, armor and aura to be obtained long before the ticket runs out. People will be "done" with the game in no-time, SIGNIFICANTLY decreasing DBOG's lifespan.

Spoils you get are permanent, even if the ticket itself isn't.

• While the ticket is temporary, anything gained from it isn't. A Budokai victory is permanent, any endgame spoils from CC110+ are permanent, as are CC auras. People crafting lvl70 armor with the lvl55 cap's zeni is an unfair headstart, yet you'll gladly let them prepare +15 lvl70 coupons for the future??

Some players have enough tickets to last them for months.

• Some players already have a ton of +15 sets of tickets. I don't know if that's from a bug or if they bought the entire game's honey, but it's worrying that these things will stick around for a LOT longer than 2 weeks.

It heavily favors and encourages cashing

• Cashers have a ton of zeni thanks to dogis, Kid Clocks, brown boxes(which are suspiciously only sell-able from the cash shop), etc. Honey can be bought with zeni. While you may be lucky to get 1 or 2 +15 tickets if you had a ton of zeni and got lucky farming honey today, cashers can easily fetch a dozen tickets. Your one chance to farm for +15 tickets has vanished. Nobody got 250+ honeyblocks alone, so if you want even one +15 ticket, zeni MUST be used to buy more honey. With Limited availability + OP ticket + sell-able and Daneos letting people keep +15 tickets, you can bet Cashers are the ones truly getting on in this. Not some f2p dude and his singular +15 ticket.

It feels cheap and insulting

• When anybody with some flimsy ticket can surpass you, it takes away from the atisfaction and pride you feel of perfecting your own powerful gear, whether done through cashing or intense effort. And that just makes playing in general demotivating.

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This entire Honey Bee event has become a nightmare rather than a blessing thanks to the inclusion of these lvl70 coupons that were promised to never work again.

Is it a dumb mistake from rushing the Honey Event? Is it some ploy for Daneos to encourage cashing? Who cares, I just hope people understand why +15 tickets aren't good for anyone. Daneos turned sealed unseal coins into regular unseal coins, and was ready to turn all U70s into U46s earlier in the OB. So we know he can turn this mistake back EASILY, but chooses not to.

Apocalypse 's definition of P2W isn't as wrong as you may think.

This Honey Bee event with +15 tickets is only this week, and the only farming period for it has already passed. I'm certain nobody got 250 honey blocks all alone in that period. Which means to get tickets, especially multiple tickets for an entire set, you must buy honey. Who has that much zeni? The guys with the boxes, Kid Clocks, and dogis. Naturally cashers would get a bigger advantage on how many tickets they can get. Hell, that may just be why Daneos allowed honey to be sell-able AND let tickets be keep-able. People paying top-dollar for limited-access OP shit would definitely be in his interests. How convenient a new cash-shop item comes out alongside it.

But this isn't about cashers vs non-cashers, nor assumptions on Daneos. The bigger issue, even for Daneos, is that lvl70's PvE will be destroyed fast at this rate. The game's final frontier, CC150, won't stand a chance against anyone who's saved up a handful of +15 tickets. A quickly-dead PvE-game isn't good for anyone.

Quote from Sirab

This was to get people to cash to buy honeys. Not because Daneos is dumb. You guys pull out any excuse for Daneos and expect him to fix things he does purposely.

This stuff will continue to happen and it's not because he lacka IQ, it's because Daneos wants to do it, what dont you people get? Honestly the only way to stop these kinds of things is to make a new server. The only way, yeah it sucks because we'll have to wait longer but the sooner the better.

EchoSon Wow and this is why he does what he does. Clearly you dont understand because you refuse to.

I've been holding back on throwing Daneos cash for years BECAUSE of things like this. It can't just be me who's thought that. Surely he must've missed out on others' cash as well for not being worthy of faith, regardless of the cause being incompetence or scumming. It's not like people had a lack of reasons to be skeptical, with the Founder Dogi's being trash, lack of balancing, no warning on Wagu nerf, return of tickets, and now this.

Sirab What does this gain him? He had cash to gain from the Wagu being OP, but what about this? He breaks his promise to not let tickets work again, and now even brings back +15 tickets full-force on lvl70 of all caps to make absolutely sure the PvE-endgame won't last over 2 weeks, it only reveals him as a backstabbing liar not worth having faith in.

Sure, there's f2p players who think they can beat experienced Budokai perfectionists with 1 or 2 pieces of +15 equipment, but beyond the ignorant support of the non-paying he mainly gains hate. You'll have to excuse that I question his rational thinking instead of assume he's an evil genius.

Not that it matters if he's scum or just rushed without thinking, I'm pissed either way. This is one of those hope-draining updates that makes quitting seem like an appeasing option. If he doesn't care about his server, why should I? I've had to hold back for years because he keeps doing these back-and-forth updates. I just don't have faith to invest in a server that might screw itself and me over in a week or two.

Quote from Sirab

Nothing will be done. It's already been confirmed if you buy a ticket right now you get to keep it.

To all the doubters that think it's not possible to get multiple tickets right now.

So what does that mean? You'd sit by and take terrible decisions from Daneos severely underestimating the impact of +15 tickets? The Honey Bee event was going to be a fun extra event for some goodies, not the key to easily claim CC150's rewards a few dozen times, the game's absolute PvE end-goal.

This entire update's become a nightmare because of that. We KNOW Daneos can turn it back without effort, just like he wanted to turn U70 to U46 stones with the Wagu machine before, or turn sealed seal coins into unsealed coins. There's zero reason not to refund players honey and change the rewards.

If the +15s stay, CC150 will be beaten in a single day. The victories you get from Budokai are permanent. The CC auras are permanent. Anything you get from CC in general is permanent, there's nothing "temporary" about that.

People will have beaten everything in the game in the first two weeks thanks to these tickets, obtained every accessory and destroyed every dungeon. Not only is it unfair for everyone who hasn't spammed the honeybee event this week, but it's unfair to everyone who's ever put in effort or will put in effort ( or donations for some of you, I guess ) to beat the game in the first place. People just now have sold honey for 100k or less. That's 25kk for a +15 weapon ticket. Add in 60kk extra for full +15 armor tickets. 85kk total, and you've beaten everything the game will ever have to offer.

You HIGHLY underestimate what people will do with a set of +15 tickets in 2 weeks. Turn the current ones into a 500k LP autopot or something and stop the tickets before they end all the game's content prematurely.

Even Daneos' own mods can't contest his ridiculous decisions? The guy used to be AGAINST tickets at one point, then he brings them back, and now he casually throws in +15 tickets for people to keep this week.

We KNOW you can change and delete items, Daneos. We know you can put up an announcement saying this will happen beforehand so people can't complain. You can STILL save the game from this mistake, so take the chance while it's still there!

Quote from Xploder

+15 tickets were only implemented because they were in retail DBO, Like the forum thread says "Can Be Changed"

Yes, but the honeyblocks are tradeable and +15 is available RIGHT now. People WILL get +15 tickets and save them up unless it's either changed right this instant, or if there's an announcement saying all +15 tickets will be deleted. And even then people will quickly use it on their lvl55 stuff.

Okay, so you'll "change" the rewards later to HOPEFULLY not include +15 lvl70 tickets lasting 2 weeks each.......but why risk players getting getting enough honey blocks to spare up +15 tickets at all? Especially if honey-blocks end up trade-able, this WILL happen.

This honey bee event shouldn't exist at all until the rewards for it make sense. Since you've already made this mistake, you've GOT to make an announcement now saying all +15 lvl70 tickets will be deleted from people's inventories before they waste 250 honeyblocks on trying to become OP easy for CC150 spam in the future. It's the only way you can still rectify this. If we allow +15 tickets, excellent-gear-only or not, then there's no reason to put any effort into the game anymore.

He better remove 'em soon anyway. +12 woulda been plenty.

This is the lvl70 cap. It's not designed for anything below the lvl70 cap, so some classes gain useful skills/passive boosts much sooner than others.

Anyone who thought this would be anything like retail's lvl55 cap has been forced to realize this the hard way by now. But hey, you won't hear SKs and Karmas complaining. "55 best cap, humans OP"

Quote from Iceman

Cap 70 is answer for everything since this client is cap 70 client, until we reach it, you can't see full potential of classes.

Yeah, this hit the nail on the head. Karmas are the best PvP class, or at least they clearly were before some bugs were fixed this week. The Budokai results prove it. But this is just some artificial lvl55 cap on a lvl70 game. It makes perfect sense lvl55 balance would be a pile of crap when the current client and stats are designed for lvl70.

I doubt Karmas will remain the best masterclass this strongly at lvl70, even with Martial Artists and Ultimates being weaker at PvP than retail. For now, let's see if Karmas continue to rule the Budokais with some of their bugs fixed and act accordingly.

Quote from Sirab

So if DonaldFreakingFireFist reports major bugs and they get fixed it's automatically a "Donald fanservice update"? Small updates? Lots of players have been waiting for those bug fixes for a while now since bugged Playful Doll was broken in Party Budokai.

Relax, pal, 'twas a joke. He was really loud about it for a long time, so he's the first guy to come to mind seeing these changes.

And they ARE small updates. Small updates with a big impact, sure, but a minor tweak from a technical standpoint nonetheless. There's no need to over-analyze it. I wish Daneos would tweak classes like this more often. Usually his balancing goes in the wrong direction, but this time, it was the right choice.

Quote from Sirab

Why? So you can make a cry thread about how PvE parties are too strict? Playful Doll is beyond broken in Kraken you can easily clear the first wave of mobs with that skill alone since the mobs attack eachother during the confusion.

How does me suggesting a buff if a potential nerf happens have anything to do with that?? I just don't want the Karma class to fall apart incase of any further nerfs. That wouldn't be equality at all.

Quote from Supertao

They might as well delete the Karma Majin class during the following weekly Karma nerfs

Where do you get the idea from there'll be further nerfs? This is the first Karma nerf I recall seeing.

Haha, we'll call this the Sendoku fanservice update then. They're small updates, but they're a great step in the right direction.

Still, for PvE Karmas, If attack speed parties ever gets nerfed one day....

Quote from Kirito

• "Playful Doll" effect now stops when getting attacked

...then you may want make it so mob auto-attacks don't stop Playful Doll. There's a huge chance mobs will target you and instantly stop the skill, or perhaps they're in the middle of an attack animation already and attack you that way. Hell, the skill itself is still quite bugged. Alot of mobs will successfully target each other, but not actually...attack.

It's not a priority now. Karmas are still top-tier at everything, so they don't need it.

Quote from Tempest

You act like Defense rate was such a useful stat in retail, which top tier player built gear with and around Defense rate again? Oh yeah that’s right, none. Because stacking Defense rate wasn’t considered to be useful.

And yes, we will refer back to retail when we want to because if something was more balanced or more efficient/effective in retail then we will refer to it. This was one of those cases.

Stop with the assumptions. It was changed because countering occurred more frequently than retail, and for no other reason.

I wouldn't dream to suggest defense rate was a top tier stat. If it was, you'd expect classes like Dark Warriors, Cranes, and Chefs to be much better in retail. Unfortunately for them it's still another advantage they'll have to miss out on in DBOG.

You can't claim this update was just to make it like retail. First, this update had nothing to do with retail. If it was, you'd have brought back the defense-rate system rather than try another random fixed rate that needs RP for some reason to function at all. The justification's even written for all to see; "it's OP on this mid-tier class"

Secondly, you ditched the "it's like retail" card once you started messing with Kaioken, SSJ, knockdown/HTB rates, and with global stat caps like cooldown, attack speed, and anti-crit. If it wasn't for literally everyone opposing you, you gladly would've screwed up properties too because it suited you. You guys chose to deviate from retail, and that's YOUR choice, but it means DBOG becoming balanced on it's own terms is in your hands.

This update negatively affects class balance for DBOG. I've already given you the reasons why, but all you've done is throw justifications why shitty balance can be overlooked. I'm sticking with my "it's bias" card until you can actually give a reason why this is a good change for DBOG itself.

Quote from Tempest

The counter rate was changed because it was too high compared to retail. A successful counter to land would occur less frequently and not come 80% of the time.

It’s only considered a “nerf” in DBO G due to the change but some of the DBO G Staff including myself felt it was occurring too frequently to the point where it felt like it was more than retail (you said it yourself, counters only have a low chance that increases with the more defence rate you have...but even then it still wasn’t by much).

You guys have shown you're willing to stray from retail whenever you want, which a fixed rate and needing RP to counter(which completely justified an 80% counterrate) is nothing like retail, mind you. But when it's suits you, you pull the "it's like retail" card to justify a nerf directed at a class that absolutely didn't need nerfing? And where'd you get the "defense rate barely had an impact on counterrate" idea from? I said it was an initially low chance to counter WITHOUT defense rate.

The statistics in DBOG don't show SM being OP with this at all.

The only route that could've lead up to this path is a certain dev member getting a vendetta against some Swordsman who beat him with this. There are so many serious balance issues in DBOG, yet THIS is what struck you as a problem. That's what we call bias.

Quote from emmanu500

no, the buffers will be in party speed with or without this system

Yah. A buffer will always be in every single party no matter what because buffs are such a huge deal. That'll never change. It's also not the point, Poko+Karmas needing to be in every party is the point, and I want to see that combination nerfed because it's objectively the most powerful party combination in the game by far and it leaves little room for any other class to exist in PvE.

"Speed parties + buffers will remain even if we change it" is not an excuse to continue doing objectively bad balancing. You don't buff Fox in Melee, why would you buff an attack speed party? We can change buffers to have a better spin WITHOUT specifically attack speed parties. There an infinite ways to do so. So what reason on earth can you or ANYONE give why it should be tied to the already OP-as-hell attack speed parties?

You can't. Even something as dumb as letting you spin faster if you have the Plasma Majin's CD buff would've been better, because at least it'd encourage an underused class to be used.

Quote from emmanu500

Wow, really ? , with this system is fine, I do not think that giving them that balance is the right thing, since they would not need anyone to finish something. it seems good to me that the turn can do more damage with the buffs of karma and poko, I quote what he said

Kaioken has the downside of draining LP, and it's not as OP as using speed parties + movement speed dogi & boots + movement speed potion even if you could crit 100% of the time. Crits deal 50% more damage IF you crit, while the speed party can go up to being 102% stronger than your default spin. So it's just a minor boost in comparison. Well...if we're going by Tempest 's standards of "minor". In my book, a minor boost would be a 10% damage increase, but the DBOG dev team doesn't do minor. You either go nuts or you go home in this team. Subtlety doesn't exist.

Quote from emmanu500

so you understand how things work

Yes! Do you? Do you understand why Poko+Karmas are a problem? Have you played DBOG on a high-end scale? Check out this video.

The issue isn't the Majin tearing through literally all of UD3's first floor solo in a single spin.(Okay, maybe that's an issue, but it's not my point or what I want to discuss) The issue is that you're forced to go with the already god-awfully OP attack speed parties to do this. The ultimate party bar-none that never needed a buff, especially after the DBOG team tried to take the "We're trying to encourage styles other than attack speed, gais :D" stance.

Quote from Hardlock

Things don't work that way. Unfortunately it's not easy to propose ideas and then do it, otherwise I assure you that there would have been A LOT of changes. Proposing ideas is very easy if you know the game a bit, the problem is making the changes.

Currently Daneos it's working on fixing bugs that is the most important thing now, when there are fewer bugs to fix, we will start working on more things.

The problem is not a "balance moderator"...

I know that. I realize it's not easy for Daneos to just edit whatever he wants in the blink of an eye. He gets massive props from me for having achieved what he has so far.

But that doesn't change that he DOES make balancing changes even when he's busy, and they're usually no good, like the recent counter update. Every time wrong balancing changes are made, that either means Daneos' efforts go to waste having to do research and then fix it, OR that the playerbase gets stuck with his bad choice. Either way, we all lose.

With a single community-chosen person calling the shots and making a template for Daneos to simply follow whenever he's got time to spare, it saves everyone time and bad ideas made up on the spot, and it means we all have someone we can ACTUALLY communicate with about balance. We don't even know whose idea it was to nerf counter or what lead to it, but we're probably stuck with this change because it's a small enough update to not cause outrage. Were you responsible, Hardlock? Was it Tempest? Daneos himself? Any random dev who got beaten by some Swordsman and raged? We don't know! So you see, we can't communicate properly. There's no way to reason, only massive outrages reach your ears.