Balance & Changes - Turtle & Crane

  • what I'm going to is that the crane needs to do more damage, so that people invite the cranes to partys and on preliminaries, I have no problem with the 1 vs 1.


    my suggestion is to modify mystical crane typhoon and make it like effect bold strike (sk).

    so that the crane can kill faster, because the damage is ridiculous compared to other characters. the duration would be modified but the damage would be much higher.

  • what I'm going to is that the crane needs to do more damage, so that people invite the cranes to partys and on preliminaries, I have no problem with the 1 vs 1.


    my suggestion is to modify mystical crane typhoon and make it like effect bold strike (sk).

    so that the crane can kill faster, because the damage is ridiculous compared to other characters. the duration would be modified but the damage would be much higher.

    im not sure why you mad, but when i played crane i still play it i had +13 gears and i had no problems dealing with sk and ultimates even tho every1 had 100% anti bleed stacked burn and gg

  • what I'm going to is that the crane needs to do more damage, so that people invite the cranes to partys and on preliminaries, I have no problem with the 1 vs 1.


    my suggestion is to modify mystical crane typhoon and make it like effect bold strike (sk).

    so that the crane can kill faster, because the damage is ridiculous compared to other characters. the duration would be modified but the damage would be much higher.

    Crane is not supposed to kill fast, it is made to make opponent suffer slowly overtime that's why they made freeze.

    Delivering dots then watching opponent rest in peace.

    SK's never been a problem just don't go to its territory which is 25m, 35m is not a problem just a bold strike which you can handle.

    The 45m stun is not a problem too.

  • Crane is not supposed to kill fast, it is made to make opponent suffer slowly overtime that's why they made freeze.

    Delivering dots then watching opponent rest in peace.

    SK's never been a problem just don't go to its territory which is 25m, 35m is not a problem just a bold strike which you can handle.

    The 45m stun is not a problem too.

    That's the problem of those who supposedly "represent" their classes. They don't understand that if you provide a boost to a specific class, it must be about improving their unique expertise abilities, not making them identical to other classes. I'm just glad that cranes are so different and don't rely on critical hits, but rather condition damage which is so remarkable and fun to use. Back in the day when I played, I was performing so well because I focused on what I can do, rather than on what I could do if I had something like my opponent. If you accept the obvious fact that your class is unique and not a straightforward damage dealer, you won't have that much trouble against most of the sks. The whole budokai system hasn't been designed properly to be fair for every class, that is undeniable. Just as against most of the classes, the hardest thing for a crane hermit to do against sk, is to keep him away at a proper distance. As long as he can't get close enough, he won't be able to do much. Slow him down, don't let him get closer, survive his bold strikes, control him. I'm not going to share a single in depth technique on how to do that as there's plenty and you have to learn it all yourself if you want to truly succeed.

  • Crane is not supposed to kill fast, it is made to make opponent suffer slowly overtime that's why they made freeze.

    Delivering dots then watching opponent rest in peace.

    SK's never been a problem just don't go to its territory which is 25m, 35m is not a problem just a bold strike which you can handle.

    The 45m stun is not a problem too.

    I think they did not understand. I'm talking about the preliminary system, cannot pass because other classes steal the kills with a slow damage. For this reason never see cranes in the game. This class always lost for this stupid system, must be created for all characters not only turtles, sk and fighters. The reason for need money, time in equip, make ccdungeon every days, its only for go to budokai. Cannot make nothing with a slow damage and many nerfs. For this reason Improve this skill, for eliminate the problem.

  • I think they did not understand. I'm talking about the preliminary system, cannot pass because other classes steal the kills with a slow damage. For this reason never see cranes in the game. This class always lost for this stupid system, must be created for all characters not only turtles, sk and fighters. The reason for need money, time in equip, make ccdungeon every days, its only for go to budokai. Cannot make nothing with a slow damage and many nerfs. For this reason Improve this skill, for eliminate the problem.

    key the many dot skills him with high speed effect.
    Would be abot 5x more dot skills then turtle skills, dammage lower, about 500 but hig speed \ 0.2 sec BUT Put it Together 1 dammage.
    Result: You put someone 4 (*500 dmg) debuff with 0,2 sec dot, then your result dammage 2000\0,2 sec. You will be a perfect last hiter.
    I think would be pref the put in together dammage system with high speed effect to crane.

  • All in all, this one will be my last post in this thread as I feel like I'm talking to a concrete wall mostly and some of the actual folks.


    To make it short and simple about one of the classes I'm well aware of, crane hermits alone face problems such as lack of skill variety, dangerous necessity of being close to your target and incapability to quickly immobilize your enemy without taking a big risk. The class itself is far from worst. If anything, it's one of the most potential classes in the entire game and only needs certain adjustments to make the class more various and viable in pve content.


    Skill variety is obviously all about rationally understandable wide choice of dots. Due to anti bleeding, this profession has nothing much to offer other than burn from spiritualist's skill tree which is risky, the other skills that cause burning aren't even worth using in most cases due to their cast time or even lower range. Everything else is focused on bleeding therefore it's not much of a dot mastery, just burn in pvp. Which in general doesn't make any sense considering that the class was specifically designed for dot variety. Just a single bleeding skill changed into something else would open more opportunities and it's all about variety and logic, relatively simple to understand.


    Speaking of range problems, is simply talking about solid burn and poison bleed which is used for paralysis. Both have a relatively low range and poison bleed even has cast time, whereas some skills in the game have a 45m range and much lower cooldown that don't require combinations to be executed. So yes, it is a very big risk to take if your enemy resists/dodges something while you're close, that's why a lot of people suggested either changing the range of poison bleed or putting double gut buster in a better use. The need to make a combination would remain that way, but it would be safer if it required you to be 28-30m close or so instead of 25 which is too risky. I usually got myself out of such predicament, but it's about what others have to say the most.


    At last, what I can tell about both spiritualist classes, is the uselessness of certain skills. Martial artist and it's subclasses had this problem fixed, only fair it gets fixed here, don't you think? Party support Is what I suggested the most to slightly improve this unfortunate group content dilemma, but even if group content is not a valid or too scary subject for them, then they better come up with something themselves.


    Looking forward to seeing how they manage turtles, particularly against cranes. Until then, thanks for the interesting exchange of ideas mates. I am done here for real. Cya. PeaceUHelloPeaches

  • Code
    "Hello, everyone, three things that need to be repaired in my opinion,
    are the liabilities that increase Dot's Damages, because in practice they do not increase
     no damage Dot's even being at the maximum, another thing are the two Buffs, the
    (Ultimate Resist It) deviation have an increase in resistance, the other is the
     (Utimate Agile Armor) the rate of Defense Rate is very low, and have a Buff Passive
    or Active that fill the RP a little faster because the Crane needs a lot of PR in the skills "
  • I do think that crane should be mainly pointed in this post, since turtles can always be found an way to counter them even if you're slowed down. or slept. ( in my opinion ) .
    Spiritualist class should be the one to be nerfed since its pretty much which makes turtle and crane op asf in pvp.
    As for pve, i think turtle should be, as someone mentioned in this post, buffed in defense buffs since they bring more penalties than actual buffs.
    And since i spoke about it and didn't detail it much, here's what i think about crane:
    Altho its their main source of damage, i think the bleed is too op. Even sk has bleed but not thousands of them. I think some abilities should NOT STACK, since the skill to detonate the DOTS deals too much high damage, even tanks cannot handle it, since it seems pretty much impossible to tank it out once you have over 6 bleeds on you, which is clearly nothing for a crane - conclusion : make it so that they cannot stack that much bleeds on their target, such as 3 limit and then AFTER they detonate, it has like a 0.5-1 second cooldown before they can start spamming bleed again ( not in PVE, but in PVP, as it would kill the class if it changed pve. ) ------my point here is that, just like any debuff, once spammed the duration and efficiency gets reduced, and the same should happen to bleeds. Specially for a class that can easily 100 to 0 you with few skills, knowing that they ALSO have a debuff to lower your HP %.
    Lastly, their "non wake up" bleed, the one from lv52, isn't too much broken, but rather it is a bit a pain in the ass as new players have to actually learn that it *insta attacks* the target if used. It should paralyse the user, as it would "kill" the benefit from that skill, which is the possibility of NOT waking up the target.

  • agree to disagree.


    Cranes need to be able to stack dots since that is the only way they can do serious damage to a target. If you are having trouble with bleeds use anti bleed gear it nutters a crane pretty good. It also stops dodon ray barrage.


    Sleep duration I will agree is long just like karmas skill lock, confusion dark beam.


    Slow down skill can be countered with movement speed boots.


    Spiritualist have the major weakeness of not having a true stun. all you have to do is get close and its ez pz gg.

  • Use senzu and not every class can fit 5x5 just like pve etc. cranes can kill ultimates one of the most broken classes+ sk and u still want more dmg wtf?

    but not karma, and need the damage for preliminars.

    Senzu? its where fight the same people in group A, where there is always a karma in that group. and need defeat to karma with crane to continue.


    or unless it touches you against 4 turtles consecutively, and karma give free win.

  • i think that turtle hermit is for the most part pretty balanced, the only thing is the turtle book giving rp to both male and female characters would be nice,or takin that out completely and changing a skill to give them an rp ball, could be easily done with changing their def boosting skills,one gives rp and the other one 500 of both defences,oh and change the dex passive to something else like increase crit damage or cd reduction,doesnt have to be some big numbers, 15% crit increase or 15 cd reduction wouldn't break the character but would be usefull for both pvp and pve

  • now crane hermit has lockdown and everything but their main problem is that if you want to do something you need to specialize in one type of dot damage,which can easily be countered with existance of 100% antibleed or antiburn and things like that,either hard capping those to 80% and increasing the base damage from skills a bit, or make the skills to be able to penetrate antibleed for like 20% of damage.

    as they stand now they have no base damage and no dot damage only decent lockdown and die easily.

  • Crane dont need any boost for now and thousand slashes should be deleted because this class is a fakin doter

    meh its only a good skill for killing tanks in particular ultimates. I think this skill should be removed as well


    but I dont agree with you zolty on crane not needing a boost in some things and nerfs for other things hear me out.

    _____________________________________________________________________________________________-

    Crane buffs

    DOT changes


    cranes need more usefulness with other dots than bleed. by implementing these changes to the 3 dots below

    cranes can actually have a true mixture of dots to utilize on there opponent.

    REASON FOR THESE SUGGESTIONS IS NO CLASS IN THIS GAME OTHER THAN CRANE CAN HAVE THERE 2BEST MOVES COMPLETELY CANCELLED

    OUT BY ACCESSORIES, THE ONLY gurantee option was solid bleed but with these changes

    cranes can be more versitile, competitive , and useful in the dbog pvp and pve scene.




    crane cyclone change: this to be adominal dot. this would also give some use for level 5 aoe spirt tongs.

    keep damage and aoe at current sp values.


    do not touch solid bleed its fine where it is! range is fine damage is fine




    poison bleed: suggestion heres what I would like done for poison bleed to make it more viable in

    combat pvp and pve no crane uses it at 7 sp due to its laughable damage and range. Keep the 1 second

    cast time for all sp! and make the damage and range as accordingly.




    1 sp 45 posion damage per 2 seconds range 25m


    2 sp 66 poison damage per 2 seconds range 25m


    3 sp 81 poison damage per 2 seconds range 28m


    4 sp 100 poison damage per 2 seconds range 28m


    5 sp 125 poison damage per 2 seconds range 30m


    6 sp 175 poison damage per 2 seconds range 30m


    7 sp 205 poison damage per 2 seconds range 35m


    ______________________________________________________________________________________________-

    Crane Nerfs: yes some of cranes skills need some minor changes since theres no reduction gears of skills


    crane freeze, the duration is very long tbh with no accessories to nerf duration this skill needs a change :(


    1 sp should give 8 seconds


    2 sp should give 12 seconds


    3 sp should give 16 seconds




    Sleep yes some folks wont be happy that im mentioning this but lets look at the facts this skill

    has a 23 second duration and has no reduction duration of accessories,

    with cd rp ball and cd gear its almost spam-able.


    I suggest reducing the cd reduction ball by a minimum of 50%, this prevents ridiculous spam ability of this skill.


    ____________________________________________________________________________________________-

    PVE fixes


    Crane Freeze: pve only allow it to be used in ccbd but nerf the duration by 75% then it wont be too overpowering.


    ______________________________________________________________________________________________________


    Turtle

    Suggestion to help turtle against Cranes there counter class




    Its common knowledge that cranes are one of the hardest classes for turtles to defeat in pvp. heres an idea




    for turtle to help them against crane class


    I say for spiritual damage breakthrough


    add a reduce sleep duration by 33% to the spiritual damage breakthrough skill at 1sp. by reducing sleep duration turtles

    stand a better chance against cranes since cranes are almost guaranteed to get the first stun off.

    I think turtles would appreciate this idea coming form a crane who has bullied ya a bit :)




    turtle book made the damn thing gender equal its agonizing to some players to have to play a female character just for the sake of getting a benefit of better pvp experience.

    ________________________________________________________________________________________________


    Turtle Buffs and nerfs


    NERF

    Turtle book give only 2 rp balls instead of full set. This gets spammed too much in pvp without consequence making them able to trap classes in a kd stun loop or ring out loop


    Buff

    hey need help in damage department! tanks are out damaging them something is wrong listen to what the turtles are sayin some have good ideas.



    turtle rod hurl skill: give it more physcial damage so they can surpise classes that use only

    energy defense armour, this will help them against energy defense walls who dominate them like ultimate majin .


    1sp 180% physcial damage 257 physcial damage


    2sp 200% physical damage 302 physical damage


    3 sp 250% physical damage 360 physcial damage


    4 sp 380% physical damage 420 physical damage


    heres my suggestions to buff and nerf crane and turtle in these areas what do u think?

  • NERF

    Turtle book give only 2 rp balls instead of full set. This gets spammed too much in pvp without consequence making them able to trap classes in a kd stun loop or ring out loop

    kd stun loop is the only way to deal with tanks right now so that would nerf them, and increasing the rod hurl wont do much since turtle hermit do not have much strength to effectivly use physical damage against tanks,only way i see this work is to give it penetrate ability like sw flash slash and make the burn on rod impale % based like sk bold strike bleed, wouldnt be 6k bleed but 800 bleed damage would go long way to chip away at tanks

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