New Upgrade System Suggestions!

Very nice text.

While on one hand I am one of those seeking an easier path as you say, I am not doing it just because it is easier, but because I am tired of getting broken after broken card, especially as you say you can see a lot of people running around in +15. For any serious budokai party you're being judged by your gear (and why wouldn't you, since 30-40% stats mean a lot) and it's a ticket to being even considered to join the party.

I get what you're saying too - if you make everything easily obtainable, people will get bored very soon since they have all. But having a good gear won't let you automatically win a coveted first place in budokai.

On the other hand, content could be made harder so you can clear it only if you're geared well by increasing the difficulty (e.g. increasing boss HP, damage output, making mechanics complicated). I've seen some videos how people clear some of the dungeons too - they use glitches to skip mechanics; gear doesn't play a role here obviously... Fixing such issues could help making the game harder and I am sure at one point in future that will get addressed too.

Also, everything could be made harder if getting to Zeni would be harder. My suggestions might trigger inflation which nobody wants, so getting Zeni should also be made harder to get.

As for the old system and AH offer. True, you can buy now +15 gear on AH now for a very nice pile of Zeni. And I don't see it being a particular problem.

What I see as potential problem is the inflation that practically every game gets to battle with sooner or later.

But then again, I don't know where you played before, but I played on TW2. There was so much you could buy for 1.000.000.000 Zeni which is credit cap in this game. Even with that money pit system game had serious issues with inflation. And what's more, even there there was a tremendous amount of players with +15, but community was considerably larger so you couldn't notice it just as easy as here. And in last years a lot of those with +15 stopped playing. You couldn't see such items on AH simply because the value was well over 1.000.000.000. The best you could find was +11, maaaaybe +12. Not because they were rare, but because the value was exceeding the credit cap. You either had to have a very well known and good middleman which could finalize the transaction in at least 2 trades since 2.000.000.000 had to be traded in two parts OR, which was actually more preferred way, you could buy it for real cash. Needless to say, it was against the rules. There was a (black?) market on some TW website on which people were listing their highly upgraded items along with their account. That was the only way of buying them, not because they were harder to get...

Edit: It's been quite a while when I last did CC on TW, obviously, but there was a time when you just couldn't pass certain CC levels without having a good group which actually knew what they were doing and had to be very well geared. Just knowing the tactics or just having the good gear was not enough...

There are mainly 2 groups in this topic. A group wants the upgrade system to be more difficult. For example, they suggest it should be the same as the KR/TW/HK version. Another group hopes that the upgrade system should be easiler, e.g. no broken, green/purple stones have +2/+3, etc.

For my opinion, I think neither is not good because they are too extreme. I think dbog has done a good job on the difficulty of upgrade system (e.g. white stone is quite easy to obtain). The problem is: it is still not fun. As many people have said before, it is not fun to farm 24hrs and become worse than before (e.g. a +12 become +10...). You will think that you are stupid, wasting of time, and then hate and quit the game. I believe that a good game needs to have a good reward system that makes players feel that they have made some progress while they are working hard. For example, people would not complain a lot about the leveling system, since the progress is clearly shown. I am sure that the dev team is able to calculate the average number of stones or time in order to get a +15 item. What the dev team needs to do is to convert the RNG system into a visible reward system. The average difficulty can be kept the same as before. People will be more happy, and hope that more people will join dbog.

Let me explain with two examples:

1) Suppose you go to a supermarket to buy something and then line up for payment. In a reward/normal system, people spend time on waiting for the queue and then they complete the order. In a RNG system, people are randomly picked up to complete the order. The average time to complete an order is the same in both systems. However, which one you prefer?

2) Assume that in the current RNG system, players need to use an average of 50 advanced stones + 50 normal stones + 50 white stones in order to convert a +14 item into a +15 item (the dev team should be able to calculate the correct number). In the reward system, players only need to collect enough stones (i.e. 50 advanced stones + 50 normal stones + 50 white stones) to perform the upgrade.

I am not totally opposed to RNG. For example, brown box for item status reroll can use RNG. Item drop can use RNG. But for the upgrade system, please don't use RNG.

A hybrid approach may be also better than the current system. e.g. +0 to +14 is reward system. +14 to +15 is RNG.

Thank you.

Quote from Box-head(boxbox)

The main problem is not upgrade sucess rate but grind. It is just not friendly for players that grind hard and thier reward is guarantee

Lets start from grind you can grind for 2 hours and you get few red/blue stones but someone else in 1h can get 3 green and 1 purple, this is not normal and fair, someone who forcing himself to grind and trying hard will lose motivation because here's is no results.

A Friend of mine suggested to add new crystals that will have 100% drop rate and let players exchange them for real stones thanks to that every player who grind will have sure reward.See image below

The crystals will have bind, drop rate of them will be 100%, 1 kill = 1 crystal (of course like today from lvl 55 monster you can drop only one stone of u50,u53,55,u58)

Now we need also add NPC where we will be able to exchange our crystals that also will have bind.

250 X u60 = 1red/blue u60
300 X u60 = White u60
600 X u60 = 1 purple/green u60

etc...

________________________________________________________________________________________________________-

-Next thing that we need to do is remove stones from tokens.
-Players should be able to collect 999 stones in one slot or even 9999 if is possible.

______________________________________________________________________________________________________

-Next is upgrade system
1- Give back broken card (when you selected broken card and you didnt use white stone your item is gone)
2- when you hit broken card you getting downgrade -3(50%) -2(40%)
3- purple/green give only +2(60%) and +3(40%)
4- 100k zeni cost for every upgrade hit (This makes a great zeni sink for the game)
5- Every upgrade fail decrease item durability by 25%, broken by 50% (if white stone is used) you can't upgrade without durability (this is for money balance and another zeni sink)

please remember that upgrade system must base on RNG (3 cards) RNG keeping balance between new comers, f2p and p2w players, someone can hit +15 with 3 stones and someone can't do that even with 100.
We just can't totally remove RNG from the game.

Now players will complain about balance because turtle will drop way more stones than fighter, and they can't move stones to fighter here we need go back to Yardat key and make ACCOUNT BIND and not CHARACTER BIND, The Yardat warehouse key opens a bank slot that can be accessible between characters on the same account
we should allow players to share all items between characters on the same account, cc items, dragon wish accessory. etc

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only this

WOW, THIS

Quote from MaoMao

There are mainly 2 groups in this topic. A group wants the upgrade system to be more difficult. For example, they suggest it should be the same as the KR/TW/HK version. Another group hopes that the upgrade system should be easiler, e.g. no broken, green/purple stones have +2/+3, etc.

For my opinion, I think neither is not good because they are too extreme. I think dbog has done a good job on the difficulty of upgrade system (e.g. white stone is quite easy to obtain). The problem is: it is still not fun. As many people have said before, it is not fun to farm 24hrs and become worse than before (e.g. a +12 become +10...). You will think that you are stupid, wasting of time, and then hate and quit the game. I believe that a good game needs to have a good reward system that makes players feel that they have made some progress while they are working hard. For example, people would not complain a lot about the leveling system, since the progress is clearly shown. I am sure that the dev team is able to calculate the average number of stones or time in order to get a +15 item. What the dev team needs to do is to convert the RNG system into a visible reward system. The average difficulty can be kept the same as before. People will be more happy, and hope that more people will join dbog.

Let me explain with two examples:

1) Suppose you go to a supermarket to buy something and then line up for payment. In a reward/normal system, people spend time on waiting for the queue and then they complete the order. In a RNG system, people are randomly picked up to complete the order. The average time to complete an order is the same in both systems. However, which one you prefer?

2) Assume that in the current RNG system, players need to use an average of 50 advanced stones + 50 normal stones + 50 white stones in order to convert a +14 item into a +15 item (the dev team should be able to calculate the correct number). In the reward system, players only need to collect enough stones (i.e. 50 advanced stones + 50 normal stones + 50 white stones) to perform the upgrade.

I am not totally opposed to RNG. For example, brown box for item status reroll can use RNG. Item drop can use RNG. But for the upgrade system, please don't use RNG.

A hybrid approach may be also better than the current system. e.g. +0 to +14 is reward system. +14 to +15 is RNG.

Thank you.

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AND THIS (just the last paragraph of the entire post)

Quote

make ACCOUNT BIND and not CHARACTER BIND, The Yardat warehouse key opens a bank slot that can be accessible between characters on the same account

we should allow players to share all items between characters on the same account, cc items, dragon wish accessory. etc

WHERE DO I SIGN?!

You guys already know udgrade system cannot be changed..IT'D BE PATETIC!. then all items udgraded will have to come back to +0 or just will there to delete them. i totally agree notoriuos if you work hard you are able to get an op gear +13/15.. yea ''FARMING HARD'' and not trying to get +15 using 2 stones pls . The current system is fair for everyone because cashers and non cashers can get their stuffs and udgrade them = using the easy way $$$ and you ya know the another one.. good ideas not bad tho.. but it's 60 cap

Quote from Scofield

You guys already know udgrade system cannot be changed..IT'D BE PATETIC!. then all items udgraded will have to come back to +0 or just will there to delete them. i totally agree notoriuos if you work hard you are able to get an op gear +13/15.. yea ''FARMING HARD'' and not trying to get +15 using 2 stones pls . The current system is fair for everyone because cashers and non cashers can get their stuff and udgrade it = using the easy way $$$ and you ya know the another one.. good ideas not bad tho.. but it's 60 cap

if the upgrade system is gonna be changed a wipe is mandatory

lots of bots on this server and thats why there are a lot of +15 gear, as some people already said in the previous posts

i dont understand why a wipe is so hated for some people here, and even if our chars are going to be deleted, leveling is not a real problem... come on, leveling up a char in this game is very easy. in the next cap your items will be useless when you get better ones anyway. maybe your accesories will hurt you to lose, but im ok with that.

i also wanted the upgrade system not to be touched, but I read some good ideas and honestly, if they can make a nice upgrade system working fine and fair for everybody without the RGN aspect, it would be awesome.

lvl 70 cap will meet us all in a fresh start. is the best solution to this server problems, cant you see it?

Just give lvl up character to 80 and new items/dungeons and tmq.

Quote from AnnaKarina

if the upgrade system is gonna be changed a wipe is mandatory

lots of bots on this server and thats why there are a lot of +15 gear, as some people already said in the previous posts

i dont understand why a wipe is so hated for some people here, and even if our chars are going to be deleted, leveling is not a real problem... come on, leveling up a char in this game is very easy. in the next cap your items will be useless when you get better ones anyway. maybe your accesories will hurt you to lose, but im ok with that.

I would agree on a serve wipe, but the server wipe is hated (atleast for me) is because some of the classes are pain in the ass to level solo and some people dont that much time to play this game (I barely get to play 1-2h per day, while there are people who play 24/7). I recently reached level 60 with Dende and let me tell you something, if it got wiped, i would not re-level again or even touch the game for quite a while

1. Leave the upgrade system itself as it is now.

2. Lower the drop rate for advanced stones.

3. No stones should be added on the cash shop.

So many funny people here. MaoMao's suggestion is the best...

Quote from sSMETESs

2. Lower the drop rate for advanced stones.

Well, you're just lucky by now. Believe me or not, It's been a week I'm not getting advanced stones. I used to get 2/3 a day.

The issue with the current upgrading system:

It is not rewarding for people who actually invest time into farming.

Someone who buys 3 upgrade stones can get a higher weapon grade, than someone who spent hour(s) farming 10 of them.

Whats wrong with current upgrade system:

- Requires only 1 item. One of the biggest joke possible.

- Does not require any Zeni. Seriously gonna need some zeni drain in this game. Make zeni useful.

- The upgrade rate. It is very frustating, farming for hours and in the end, your weapon might even get a lower grade than it was or doesn't change at all.

- Advanced Upgrade Stones. The upgrade should go 1 by 1. Gaining 2-3 grades per upgrade is just stupid and makes it too easy.

Wether RNG should stay or not is complicated.

In my opinion, RNG should stay, but the rate should be high and not at the 1-50% range.

the broken Card is gone and everyone is happy

Quote from [PL]Daneos

The issue with the current upgrading system:

It is not rewarding for people who actually invest time into farming.

Someone who buys 3 upgrade stones can get a higher weapon grade, than someone who spent hour(s) farming 10 of them.

Whats wrong with current upgrade system:

- Requires only 1 item. One of the biggest joke possible.

- Does not require any Zeni. Seriously gonna need some zeni drain in this game. Make zeni useful.

- The upgrade rate. It is very frustating, farming for hours and in the end, your weapon might even get a lower grade than it was or doesn't change at all.

- Advanced Upgrade Stones. The upgrade should go 1 by 1. Gaining 2-3 grades per upgrade is just stupid and makes it too easy.

Wether RNG should stay or not is complicated.

In my opinion, RNG should stay, but the rate should be high and not at the 1-50% range.

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A system with 1 in 1 is nice, maybe you can explore others systems differents to the RNG like the goals system that I suggest. Is not a easy system and the people needs farm for hours and hours if want a good upgrade.

Quote from Linkoutsider

I have a sugestion, it can be a little bit drastic and incomplete but i think that it can really help, hope that you guys enjoy, if you have questions and some other ideas tell me i can try to help more

Let me Know your Opinion's Toward my idea

Guys, we will need item break lmao. Do you guys seriously don't see the problem by having no break opton or do you try hard to ignore it?

No break = Server full of high upgraded stuff -----> Not much worth cuz there is too many things.

This will be bad ingame economy. Hard to make money for F2P cuz they won't be able to sell stuff. Cashers will make money with selling cash shop items and buy the high upgraded stuff which is cheap to them since they got money....

Basic economy ppl, come on. Too much stuff = drop in value cuz many ppl have it already. And in order to sell, ppl will drop price.

Quote from Syren

Hello DBO G Community,

With the new client we are able to do more than ever before, Which is why we would like to hear your ideas on a potential new upgrade system. We want to revamp the entire system or as much as needed to create the best possible experience.

Suggestions must include:

- What is needed to upgrade

- Where you obtain the items you need to upgrade

- The information regarding the upgrades E.G Blue/Red = +1 Green/Purple = +1-3

Please explain in full detail so we can understand exactly what you mean.

The idea of this thread is to gain some ideas to really make the best possible upgrade system one which is either RNG free or with at least possible RNG (Random Number Generated)

Thanks in advance!

Syren - DBO G Staff Team

Reminder that all forum rules still apply here. If you want to leave any suggestions and express your opinions, please do so in a civilized manner.

Versión en Español

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I have a sugestion, it can be a little bit drastic and incomplete but i think that it can really help, hope that you guys enjoy

- For equips: since you upgrade them they become binded and you cant no more unbind;

- You will still be able to unbind the equips if you just used them without upgrading;

- Seal coins must be harder to get or to unseal an unupgraded equip must be for example 30 seal coins;

- Example: Seal Coins Can be bought in game for 1kkz each/or Make a "casino to waste money to get stuff";

- Seal coins from cash have binds;

- The idea of a "Casino" would be great for example in Weast City where there is a huge thing being constructed xD

BTW that's only a idea, but i really think it can help the game to become a better one... if you see something that's inconvinient with this idea or some missing stuff pls tell me i will try to find a solution

IMPORTANT: watch the photos cause the rest of the idea is there

This idea is mine and from Zarden.

Greetings:

Nephis "aka" Ninpadame

ZardenBuffer

I rather you just get rid of the entire upgrading system and just make the weapons into a way where they get stronger the more you grind. I see no point in continuing with a system that everyone keeps complaining about.

the entire game needs an overhaul starting with getting rid of class systems entirely, and utilize actual power leveling experience system to gain new abilities throughout all the previous class systems. But in this case now saiyans, namekians and majins getting a choice to choose and develop what skills they want to use as a global factor. And not just another limited factor that gets old very quickly. You now have a new client to make those changes. There should no longer be a barrier keeping you from obtaining these goals. Otherwise, you're just sitting there forever lacking and witholding no actual imagination stemming from the DBZ universe. No more excuses.

As reference by other MMORPG game's upgrade system, I have

the following suggestions:

1.Since the enhancement success rate always decreases with high

updated level which is common in most of MMORPG games. So I think the card choosing is not necessary to the upgrade system. It should be removed and provide a button for enhancement without choosing card which has no actual meaning.

2.Both of weapon and armor should have the same updating rule. 100% update success rate should be available between +0 and +4 only. The success rate of those equipment with upgrade level from +7 will greatly decrease.

Upgrade System:

Here's the references:

Level Success White stone Green/Purple Stone (+2~+3) Downgrade(Max) With white stone Downgrade without white stone

+0 ~ +4 ----- 100% ------- No -------- Yes --------- -0 --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+4 ~ +5 ----- 80% ------- Yes -------- Yes --------- -0 --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+5 ~ +7 ----- 50% ------- Yes -------- Yes --------- -0 --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+7 ~ +8 ----- 40% ------- Yes -------- Yes --------- -0 --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+8 ~ +10 ----- 30% ------- Yes -------- Yes --------- -1 (30%) --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+11 ~ +12 ----- 15% ------- Yes -------- Yes --------- -1 (30%) --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+12 ~ +13 ----- 10% ------- Yes -------- No --------- -2 (50%) --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+13 ~ +14 ----- 5% ------- Yes -------- No --------- -2 (50%) --------- direct to +0 (50%)

+14 ~ +15 ----- 1% ------- Yes -------- No --------- -2 (70%) -------- direct to +0 (50%)

Even we had one wipe while open beta was started, we found that lots of players have full +15 armor until now. Compared to TW / Old version, it is

not possible to be happened even the game was run for almost 3 years.

It reveals that the upgrade system is still too easy for enhancement for cash player. In order to make the game environment healthy, the success rate

and upgrade rule should be changed and make it hard to upgrade even the cash player who cannot acheive +15 so easily.

For Downgrade rule, upgrade with white stone should have downgrade rate as above. The max downgrade level is 2 or no downgrade penalty if upgrade

fails. Upgrade without white stone will downgrade to +0 with 50% chance if fails.

For White stone, it is great to remove broken rule because some effects are hard to generate on the armor. White stone could be used from +4 to +15.

For purple/green stone, the upgrade level should be set as +2 ~ +3 that removing +1. It can be used if the equipment is +11 or below. If you have

extreme luck, you still have chance to upgrade from +11 to +14.

Remove downgrade stone, downgrade the equipment by paying zeni.

Upgradable items:

Main Weapon +0 ~ +15 (glove/stuff)

Sub Weapon +0 ~ +15 (sword/fan....etc)

Armor (Top, pant, shoes) +0 ~ +15

Dogi +0 ~ +5

Upgrade Stone Drop rate:

TMQ > Dungeon > Event > Farming

* CCDB can also get stones from capsule (based on floors).

The above suggestion seems hard to upgrade but it really can decrease the proportional of +13 ~ +15 full gear in the community.

Apart from upgrade system, I suggest multi-client can be limited to 2 as maximum.

What do you guys think about an upgrading system similar to Blade and Soul ?
For those who doesn t know about it, the BnS ( short for Blade and soul ) upgrading system is all about grinding.

this is what i was thinking of : Since there is a variety of gloves, subs and armors etc...

Why not link them all together, and yeah upgrading gloves will start from lvl30 and before that you can use whatever you find from drops etc... for example:

- lvl30 glove/armor/sub --> lvl31 glove/armor/sub you need a certain amount of items, it doesn t have to be too many since it s for the first upgrade ( no idea what items we can use somthing like the craft items or others but you get the idea)

-The higher the lvl the higher the amount of items needed.

-Now from lvl60 and higher, this will change a bit

• Apart from the items needed for upgrading this upgrade will have a chance to fail (No worries you don t have to lose item or go back to the previous upgrade, you ONLY lose the stuff you used for upgrade)
• White stones this item will be used to have a discount on the amount of stuff needed by 20% for example ( And make it hard to obtain maybe from Tmq6-7 and UD5-6 and bids with a low chance to drop).

Finally since BnS only have gloves and accesories, i suggest we make the stuff needed for upgrades different for Wep/Sub/Armor so you don't have to stick to only certain items, if you have other suggestion how we can make this work feel free to add it.